Warhammer 40k

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Love_Machine011 said:
It would! It also probably would have helped with his fight with the swarmlord too :^).
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I can see at least in universe why they wouldn't risk the procedure that has a 50% mortality rate on the oldest most championed space marine that serves as the commander of half the the Imperium. I mean we all know he has plot armor and would be fine and I guess he has plot armor in universe too but it would be pretty embarrassing if he died on the operating table and had to explain that to the Sanguinor.

I'm fine with Dante remaining an og marine. I like to think he is just too old and busy to want to deal with the hassle of becoming a primaris marine. It also helps that he doesn't feel insecure like Calgar probably does now that poppa is back home.
 
Burned Man said:
I can see at least in universe why they wouldn't risk the procedure that has a 50% mortality rate on the oldest most championed space marine that serves as the commander of half the the Imperium. I mean we all know he has plot armor and would be fine and I guess he has plot armor in universe too but it would be pretty embarrassing if he died on the operating table and had to explain that to the Sanguinor.

I'm fine with Dante remaining an og marine. I like to think he is just too old and busy to want to deal with the hassle of becoming a primaris marine. It also helps that he doesn't feel insecure like Calgar probably does now that poppa is back home.
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I guess that is fair. Really I just wanted to see what his new design looks like now that papa dumbass told him to stop wearing the deathmask.
 
Love_Machine011 said:
I guess that is fair. Really I just wanted to see what his new design looks like now that papa dumbass told him to stop wearing the deathmask.
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I'm sure they will get around to making him primaris eventually and if not its entirely possible he'll get a new model to keep in line with other special characters anyway. Who knows.
 
Burned Man said:
I can see at least in universe why they wouldn't risk the procedure that has a 50% mortality rate on the oldest most championed space marine that serves as the commander of half the the Imperium. I mean we all know he has plot armor and would be fine and I guess he has plot armor in universe too but it would be pretty embarrassing if he died on the operating table and had to explain that to the Sanguinor.

I'm fine with Dante remaining an og marine. I like to think he is just too old and busy to want to deal with the hassle of becoming a primaris marine. It also helps that he doesn't feel insecure like Calgar probably does now that poppa is back home.
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I think it has been updated with the new Psychic Awakening books or the latest space marine codex but the rubicon primaris procedure no longer has a significant kill rate. The explanation is that it has been done enough times that the apothecaries understand what they are doing.

It’s basically a plot device to allow for characters to be primaris. That’s not to say that you could have one of your characters die in the operation, but it most likely means that named characters aren’t going to die if they go through the rubicon.
 
Imperial Citizen said:
I think it has been updated with the new Psychic Awakening books or the latest space marine codex but the rubicon primaris procedure no longer has a significant kill rate. The explanation is that it has been done enough times that the apothecaries understand what they are doing.

It’s basically a plot device to allow for characters to be primaris. That’s not to say that you could have one of your characters die in the operation, but it most likely means that named characters aren’t going to die if they go through the rubicon.
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Basically summarises as, "None of the special characters are going to die from doing this", which itself is shorthand for, "Why haven't you bought your entire armies again as Primaris yet, goyim?!"
 
That Chris Guy said:
Basically summarises as, "None of the special characters are going to die from doing this", which itself is shorthand for, "Why haven't you bought your entire armies again as Primaris yet, goyim?!"
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People would be more pissed off if a named character just died because of a botched surgery. And at least they do create some interesting plot threads for why the characters went through the rubicon.

Calgary did it to show acceptance of the new marines. Khan did it to hunt the Red Cosairs for their attack on Chorgoris. The Dark Angels guy became the first primaris member of the inner circle, but he’s now extremely distrusted.

Here’s something that I don’t think anyone has mentioned, but in order to make a primaris marine, you still have to go through the normal marine process. There’s no reason that a chapter of primaris marines can’t have firstborn marines. So I don’t think the true marines are going away, it’s just that GW wants to sell its latest product.
 
Never really was a fan of primaris marines. Didnt care about the model aspect at the time because I wasnt interested in playing the game. Just always seemed like a sort of retarded plot point that you had one of the biggest mechanicum wierdos doing this at the behest of Roboute. Especially when one of the major features is that you made them bigger so then cant fit into anything not designed for them. (oh I wonder why). Also having them mostly unaffected by gene seed flaws kinda washes away a lot of the flavors of a legion/chapter. Seth essentially made the point that Roboute was just trying to turn all the chapters into ultramarines, which is fairly on the nose, and somewhat saddening.
 
Love_Machine011 said:
Never really was a fan of primaris marines. Didnt care about the model aspect at the time because I wasnt interested in playing the game. Just always seemed like a sort of exceptional plot point that you had one of the biggest mechanicum wierdos doing this at the behest of Roboute. Especially when one of the major features is that you made them bigger so then cant fit into anything not designed for them. (oh I wonder why). Also having them mostly unaffected by gene seed flaws kinda washes away a lot of the flavors of a legion/chapter. Seth essentially made the point that Roboute was just trying to turn all the chapters into ultramarines, which is fairly on the nose, and somewhat saddening.
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There has been a lot of developments in the primaris since they came out. The flaws are back, but not as excessive as the degraded gene seed of the firstborn. They set up that Cawl has been working on the primaris since the end of the Heresy, giving some explanation of why there are so many of them.

Model wise, I see something thematic about their lack of vehicles. The primaris are just another dam built to hold the flood of chaos at bay. No drop pods, no assault marines, nothing designed to advance the Imperium’s position. It’s either surgical covert strikes to sabatoge the enemy or long range support to stop the enemy at a distance. Because of the Great Rift, what was supposed to be the next generation of space marines to expand the Imperium have been used to hold what little ground they still have.
 
Imperial Citizen said:
People would be more pissed off if a named character just died because of a botched surgery. And at least they do create some interesting plot threads for why the characters went through the rubicon.

Calgary did it to show acceptance of the new marines. Khan did it to hunt the Red Cosairs for their attack on Chorgoris. The Dark Angels guy became the first primaris member of the inner circle, but he’s now extremely distrusted.

Here’s something that I don’t think anyone has mentioned, but in order to make a primaris marine, you still have to go through the normal marine process. There’s no reason that a chapter of primaris marines can’t have firstborn marines. So I don’t think the true marines are going away, it’s just that GW wants to sell its latest product.
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It's not like the Space Marines' character library couldn't stand to have a little pruning done to it. Like I think I said once before in this topic: there are enough bloody SM special characters to have a standing army purely composed of them. I think Chaos might be the only other faction which could equally make such a claim. Bumping off a few E-listers won't rustle many jimmies.

I still feel like it's the beginning of the end for 3rd Edition Marine models being phased out and replaced by Primaris equivalents, but it's not like they'll be unfieldable or anything.

Imperial Citizen said:
Model wise, I see something thematic about their lack of vehicles. The primaris are just another dam built to hold the flood of chaos at bay. No drop pods, no assault marines, nothing designed to advance the Imperium’s position. It’s either surgical covert strikes to sabatoge the enemy or long range support to stop the enemy at a distance. Because of the Great Rift, what was supposed to be the next generation of space marines to expand the Imperium have been used to hold what little ground they still have.
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Or it could be that having no vehicles sells the impression of Spartan warriors holding back hordes better than rolling them around in tanks...

Then again, I'm not sure about GW's thematics anymore. They gave the cyborg sycophants some weedier Juggernauts for mounts to go with their hovercrafts, and all the heavy-looking, brutal vehicles of the Astartes are being replaced by trimmed-down counterparts (i,e: rollcage dreadnought, Repulsors).
 
That Chris Guy said:
It's not like the Space Marines' character library couldn't stand to have a little pruning done to it. Like I think I said once before in this topic: there are enough bloody SM special characters to have a standing army purely composed of them. I think Chaos might be the only other faction which could equally make such a claim. Bumping off a few E-listers won't rustle many jimmies.

I still feel like it's the beginning of the end for 3rd Edition Marine models being phased out and replaced by Primaris equivalents, but it's not like they'll be unfieldable or anything.



Or it could be that having no vehicles sells the impression of Spartan warriors holding back hordes better than rolling them around in tanks...

Then again, I'm not sure about GW's thematics anymore. They gave the cyborg sycophants some weedier Juggernauts for mounts to go with their hovercrafts, and all the heavy-looking, brutal vehicles of the Astartes are being replaced by trimmed-down counterparts (i,e: rollcage dreadnought, Repulsors).
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This isn't Kirby's GW. Outside of removing some of the Warhammer Fantasy models for Cities of Sigmar or when updating sprues, Games Workshop has not phased out models. The reason they are only showing primaris marines in promotional material or in an 'eavy metal section of a codex is because their policy is to present the most recent released models. If you look up the recent Sisters of Battle codex, only half of the army's range is shown painted because only half the range was released with the codex back in January.

On the vehicles comment, that could be another interesting way of seeing their range. But I agree that the Primaris feel too clean. Having something like a skull symbol carved into the backpack would keep it in the 40k aesthetic.

Though I disagree on the Ad Mech's new fire breathing cyborg horses because that is such an 80s metal concept that makes you wonder why it wasn't include in 40k before now.
 
Imperial Citizen said:
Though I disagree on the Ad Mech's new fire breathing cyborg horses because that is such an 80s metal concept that makes you wonder why it wasn't include in 40k before now.
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I'm hoping those are going to be able to infiltrate or something while being a reasonable point cost. That being said even if they aren't good I'm going to grab a kit based on looks alone.
 
When are the space marines going to stop being so white and male? It does not reflect the diversity of the modern UK.
 
HumanHive said:
When are the space marines going to stop being so white and male? It does not reflect the diversity of the modern UK.
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What are you talking about? Orks and Tyranids are already in the game.

The one good thing about Primaris marines for me are they make normal space marines feel a sense of inadequacy which is funny. Now they know what its like to be a Guardsmen.

I want to see more of the Primaris growing pains like their brand of Termies are released but are so large they can't actually do normal Termie things like Space Hulk missions because they get completely stuck in the hallways.

I think a lot of the skub with Primaris marines would have been prevented if they were just the same size so it didn't feel like super duper Space Marines but just more refined Space Marines designed to mitigate flaws while having new gear.
 
Burned Man said:
What are you talking about? Orks and Tyranids are already in the game.

The one good thing about Primaris marines for me are they make normal space marines feel a sense of inadequacy which is funny. Now they know what its like to be a Guardsmen.

I want to see more of the Primaris growing pains like their brand of Termies are released but are so large they can't actually do normal Termie things like Space Hulk missions because they get completely stuck in the hallways.

I think a lot of the skub with Primaris marines would have been prevented if they were just the same size so it didn't feel like super duper Space Marines but just more refined Space Marines designed to mitigate flaws while having new gear.
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I'm not a huge fan of the primaris marines but I don't hate them as much as some people. I've collected on & off for about 20 years & whilst Space Marines were never an army I invested hugely in (I have about 800pts of unpainted troops but I got bored) I always liked their warrior monk vibe. It worked well considering the Imperium is very theocratic. The new Primaris look sleek & modern, this design would be great for a revamp of the Imperial Guard (sick of Cadian models) or maybe just the Smurfs seeing as Guilliman is awake now & would wanna upgrade his little blue men but it just doesn't fit the lore & aesthetic for chapters like the Dark Angels or Space Wolves.

Also 1d4chan is down. Wack.
 
Perhaps instead of working on Roboute's retardation, Cawl should have been doing something actually useful(optimistic I know). Like perhaps work on the golden throne, or figure out the tryanid's FTL travel. You know, instead of trying to improve the emperor's middle grade genetics project.

I just don't see the point of making something stronger then a space marine and not as loyal as a custodian. I'm sure failbbadon and the other chaos rejects are going to be looking to boost their numbers soon enough.
 
Fabius Bile is always eager for new test subjects and involuntary tissue and gene donors. Considering he's probably the only person better equipped to know the nuts and bolts of the Astartes process than Cawl, he might finally manage to make those New Men he's been after for so long. His own army of transhuman warriors, ones that are still human too, unlike the Astartes.
 
Snekposter said:
Fabius Bile is always eager for new test subjects and involuntary tissue and gene donors. Considering he's probably the only person better equipped to know the nuts and bolts of the Astartes process than Cawl, he might finally manage to make those New Men he's been after for so long. His own army of transhuman warriors, ones that are still human too, unlike the Astartes.
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And they are coming in the the psychic awakening book "war of the spider" to face off against the talons of the emperor. Absolutely based.
 
So I'm very much new to the franchise other than the video games. A friend recommended to me the Forges of Mars Trilogy as a good starting point for getting more into the lore of 40K. Would you guys agree with that assessment or is there a better book/series to start with?
 
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