Western Animation - Discuss American, Canadian, and European cartoons here (or just bitch about wokeshit, I guess)

[Rinny.]

Still, he's the only black character, as far as I know. But according to @Rinny, that's SJW pandering and "putting blacks at the front".

Starting to understand why you have such a poor reaction score.

 

[Marissa Moira]

Social minority and numerical minority aren't the same thing.

Social minority is also a matter of opinion which means, the argument will never end.

 

[LiquidKid]

Still, he's the only black character, as far as I know. But according to @Rinny, that's SJW pandering and "putting blacks at the front".

You’re the dude that couldn’t tolerate Spiderverse because it had a black guy as Spider-Man instead of the white dude who was also in the movie as Spider-Man.
You don’t get to put that sentence in quotes

 

[NNewt84]

You’re the dude that couldn’t tolerate Spiderverse because it had a black guy as Spider-Man instead of the white dude who was also in the movie as Spider-Man.
You don’t get to put that sentence in quotes

The difference is that Franklin isn't at the forefront of Peanuts, nor did Schulz kill off Charlie Brown just to put Franklin in his place to put across some woke message that "anyone can be Charlie Brown". He's the token black guy. He's just there to show they're inclusive, and that's it.

Also, you're really bringing up that old drama again? Pretty hypocritical coming from the guy who rails on me for dwelling on months-old drama.

 

[LiquidKid]

The difference is that Franklin isn't at the forefront of Peanuts, nor did Schulz kill off Charlie Brown just to put Franklin in his place to put across some woke message that "anyone can be Charlie Brown". He's the token black guy. He's just there to show they're inclusive, and that's it.

Also, you're really bringing up that old drama again? Pretty hypocritical coming from the guy who rails on me for dwelling on months-old drama.

Black people exist, Sam. it’s not instantly virtue signaling just because you use a black character for something. If we can all accept that autistic Australians with give their sisters sexually charged leg massages whilst forgetting to take out the trash exist, you can accept that black people exist.

 

[OmnipotentStupidity]

Social minority and numerical minority aren't the same thing.

Social minority is also a matter of opinion which means, the argument will never end.

I appreciate the effort in trying to counter his arguments, but y'all are fighting a losing battle: you're never gonna convince ol' Fly Fucker McGee over here to not hate blacks and women. It's better to just let the Aussie have his tantrum, sperg out, and then move on. Although if you're lucky, you'll get some front row seats and watch him spout more new embarassing shit about himself. God only knows if he'll go 4 for 4 here and continue his streak.

 

[SnowBall]

You know I have been thinking of Miyazaki’s quote of the current state of anime and I think that it can equally apply to how modern western animation is these days. Full of people who can’t stand looking at others and an industry full of fanboys.

 

[LiquidKid]

[

I appreciate the effort in trying to counter his arguments, but y'all are fighting a losing battle: you're never gonna convince ol' Fly Fucker McGee over here to not hate blacks and women. It's better to just let the Aussie have his tantrum, sperg out, and then move on. Although if you're lucky, you'll get some front row seats and watch him spout more new embarassing shit about himself. God only knows if he'll go 4 for 4 here and continue his streak.

im holding out for a confirmation of if he’s fapped to his sisters insta since like all women, it’s nothing but bikini pics

 

[Private Pyle]

Full of people who can’t stand looking at others and an industry full of fanboys.

Wow, this actually does sum up the industry the more I think about it. The first person that immediately comes to mind when it comes to fanboys is Ian Jones Quartey, who basically used his TV show as a spring board for crossovers and references for cartoons he grew up with. As for “can’t stand looking at others”, well, twitter exists.

 

[NNewt84]

Black people exist, Sam. it’s not instantly virtue signaling just because you use a black character for something. If we can all accept that autistic Australians with give their sisters sexually charged leg massages whilst forgetting to take out the trash exist, you can accept that black people exist.

Just because a demographic exists, doesn't mean we need to cater to them at every single opportunity and put them on a pedestal like they're the Messiah. Except dogs - dogs are the Messiah.

But back to the main point, there already exist plenty of black superheroes. Meteor Man, Spawn, Blade, Storm, Hancock, Nick Fury, Rena Rouge, Carapace, and let's not forget Black Panther, the most popular black superhero of the 2010s. There's no reason the black community is so desperate that they need to recycle a pre-existing character and make him black, and label anyone who dislikes that as a racist.

What really baffles me, though, is that one of the Kiwis brought up The Gods Must Be Crazy as an example of a film with black representation. Like, bruh... the film was made in South Africa, where black people are the majority - it would be weird if it didn't star mostly black actors. How ironic, in an attempt to show how not racist he was, the only made himself look racist by implying that blacks' minority status is worldwide, and whites are the global "default" race.

I appreciate the effort in trying to counter his arguments, but y'all are fighting a losing battle: you're never gonna convince ol' Fly Fucker McGee over here to not hate blacks and women. It's better to just let the Aussie have his tantrum, sperg out, and then move on. Although if you're lucky, you'll get some front row seats and watch him spout more new embarassing shit about himself. God only knows if he'll go 4 for 4 here and continue his streak.

Okay, I'm going to spell this out for you so you get it.

Women = 51%, not a minority.
Blacks = 12%, a minority.

Surely they would have taught you about percentages in school, right?

The whole point I've been getting at is that being female is not the same as being black, and I was using Hilda as an example of a modern show that actually understands this. Instead of lumping girls and blacks together like is apparently cool nowadays, it puts girls at the forefront, and the one black character is reduced to a sidekick. Yet somehow, that got misconstrued as me thinking Hilda conforms to the intersectional SJW mindset, i.e. "hurhur, women and minority representation".

Like, come on - I literally used the words "white female protagonist [...] token black [...] token male". As in, a gender swap of the usual white male protagonist the feminists like to rag on so much, and the token black and female representation they desperately crave so much. Granted, Hilda is by no means the first show to do this - there's also Punky Brewster, Sabrina: The Animated Series, Kim Possible and Miraculous Ladybug, just to name examples - but Hilda came out at a time when it's cool to label women as a "minority" class, and treat them as "weird" and "abnormal" just to prove how women are capable - somehow. It very easily could have succumbed to that intersectional SJW mindset, by making Hilda a black lesbian with Down syndrome. But instead, they chose not to do that, instead just focusing on writing a well-written protagonist who just happens to be a girl. If anything, the show runs on reverse intersectionality, treating the male gender as a "minority" group by giving Hilda a male sidekick in addition to a black one. (It's still intersectionality, though, right? There's no such thing as "reverse intersectionality".)

Of course, if every show had a token male character, that would be blatantly sexist. Instead, it's good to have a balance of male-led shows with token females, and female-led shows with token males.

Maybe next time, you guys should work on your reading comprehension. That way, you won't shit up another thread by completely misinterpreting what people are saying.

And that's my time for today. If you have any questions, feel free to ask!

 

[LiquidKid]

Just because a demographic exists, doesn't mean we need to cater to them at every single opportunity and put them on a pedestal like they're the Messiah. Except dogs - dogs are the Messiah.

View attachment 1310676

But back to the main point, there already exist plenty of black superheroes. Meteor Man, Spawn, Blade, Storm, Hancock, Nick Fury, Rena Rouge, Carapace, and let's not forget Black Panther, the most popular black superhero of the 2010s. There's no reason the black community is so desperate that they need to recycle a pre-existing character and make him black, and label anyone who dislikes that as a racist.

What really baffles me, though, is that one of the Kiwis brought up The Gods Must Be Crazy as an example of a film with black representation. Like, bruh... the film was made in South Africa, where black people are the majority - it would be weird if it didn't star mostly black actors. How ironic, in an attempt to show how not racist he was, the only made himself look racist by implying that blacks' minority status is worldwide, and whites are the global "default" race.



Okay, I'm going to spell this out for you so you get it.

Women = 51%, not a minority.
Blacks = 12%, a minority.

Surely they would have taught you about percentages in school, right?

The whole point I've been getting at is that being female is not the same as being black, and I was using Hilda as an example of a modern show that actually understands this. Instead of lumping girls and blacks together like is apparently cool nowadays, it puts girls at the forefront, and the one black character is reduced to a sidekick. Yet somehow, that got misconstrued as me thinking Hilda conforms to the intersectional SJW mindset, i.e. "hurhur, women and minority representation".

Like, come on - I literally used the words "white female protagonist [...] token black [...] token male". As in, a gender swap of the usual white male protagonist the feminists like to rag on so much, and the token black and female representation they desperately crave so much. Granted, Hilda is by no means the first show to do this - there's also Punky Brewster, Sabrina: The Animated Series, Kim Possible and Miraculous Ladybug, just to name examples - but Hilda came out at a time when it's cool to label women as a "minority" class, and treat them as "weird" and "abnormal" just to prove how women are capable - somehow. It very easily could have succumbed to that intersectional SJW mindset, by making Hilda a black lesbian with Down syndrome. But instead, they chose not to do that, instead just focusing on writing a well-written protagonist who just happens to be a girl. If anything, the show runs on reverse intersectionality, treating the male gender as a "minority" group by giving Hilda a male sidekick in addition to a black one. (It's still intersectionality, though, right? There's no such thing as "reverse intersectionality".)

Of course, if every show had a token male character, that would be blatantly sexist. Instead, it's good to have a balance of male-led shows with token females, and female-led shows with token males.

Maybe next time, you guys should work on your reading comprehension. That way, you won't shit up another thread by completely misinterpreting what people are saying.

And that's my time for today. If you have any questions, feel free to ask!

Ignoring the rather large amount of white South Africans,
You’re missing a very key element of comic book characters, they often pass the torch on. Nearly every hero has been taken over by a different character at one point or another. Hell, there was a period were amazing spider-man ended for superior spider-man, a story about doc oc body swapping with Peter right before He died and continuing on in Peter’s body as spider-man.
meanwhile, Miles has always been just another spider-man. Keeping with the trend that Peter was not the only guy with spider powers(ever hear of the clone saga?Because that shitshow revealed that spider-man isn’t even the real Peter Parker, Scarlet Spider is). Miles was never intended to replace peter, his purpose was to add to the universe and tell stories that Peter doesn’t fit into. In short, he WAS a new super hero who just happens to share a world with an old one,
Don’t get me wrong though, his comic was horrible. The movie is the first time the character has been good, let alone tolerable.

 

[OmnipotentStupidity]

Like, come on - I literally used the words "white female protagonist [...] token black [...] token male". As in, a gender swap of the usual white male protagonist the feminists like to rag on so much, and the token black and female representation they desperately crave so much. Granted, Hilda is by no means the first show to do this - there's also Punky Brewster

Punky Brewster: peak feminism representation in modern media

I'm fucking dead

 

[NNewt84]

Punky Brewster: peak feminism representation in modern media

I'm fucking dead

Again, way to completely miss the point. I was listing Punky Brewster as a show that doesn't adhere to feminist ideals, since it has a - say it with me now - white female protagonist with a token black friend and a token male friend. (Granted, the latter would be written out of the show as of Season 3.)

But if you're criticising the "modern" part, since it came out in the 80s, I was specifically referring to Hilda as a modern show, not Punky Brewster. The reason I brought up those older shows was to point out that Hilda didn't invent the "WFP with TBF" trope. However, since Punky Brewster came out long before this whole "SJW" nonsense got out of hand, I find it's not a very good example to use of a show going against the SJW grain. But since Hilda came out rather recently, it's a fine example of a show where the writers likely intentionally avoided the SJW mindset, hence why I emphasised "modern" for Hilda.

Ignoring the rather large amount of white South Africans,

Yes, I'm aware there are proportionally more white people in South Africa than other African nations. However, they make up less than 10% of South Africa, so it's like saying there's a "rather large amount of Asian Americans".

 

[Bread Fetishist]

Again, way to completely miss the point. I was listing Punky Brewster as a show that doesn't adhere to feminist ideals, since it has a - say it with me now - white female protagonist with a token black friend and a token male friend. (Granted, the latter would be written out of the show as of Season 3.)

But if you're criticising the "modern" part, since it came out in the 80s, I was specifically referring to Hilda as a modern show, not Punky Brewster. The reason I brought up those older shows was to point out that Hilda didn't invent the "WFP with TBF" trope. However, since Punky Brewster came out long before this whole "SJW" nonsense got out of hand, I find it's not a very good example to use of a show going against the SJW grain. But since Hilda came out rather recently, it's a fine example of a show where the writers likely intentionally avoided the SJW mindset, hence why I emphasised "modern" for Hilda.



Yes, I'm aware there are proportionally more white people in South Africa than other African nations. However, they make up less than 10% of South Africa, so it's like saying there's a "rather large amount of Asian Americans".

Dude, why must you keep shitting up threads with your relentless autism?

 

[NNewt84]

Dude, why must you keep shitting up threads with your relentless autism?

All I wanted to do (this time) was make a comment on the intersectional mindset that women are a minority, and I used Hilda as an example of how it is in fact possible to treat women as a non-minority. Unfortunately, someone here misinterpreted it and thought I was saying Hilda perpetuated the intersectional mindset, and I had to clear it up. And of course, everyone just had to get in on the debate, because why not?

 

[Rinny.]

Unfortunately, someone here misinterpreted it and thought I was saying Hilda perpetuated the intersectional mindset, and I had to clear it up. And of course, everyone just had to get in on the debate, because why not?

This "someone" (guess you couldn't dare @ me this time, lol) doesn't really care about your autistic rant about blacks/women in cartoons or whatever the fuck point you're trying to say- I can't blame myself with how I interrupted your comment because your writing sucks and none of this makes much sense or matters lol

 

[Private Pyle]

Seriously, if his autism is getting to you, report him or something or just ignore him. The thread is getting really derailed from cartoons.

 

[OmnipotentStupidity]

Seriously, if his autism is getting to you, report him or something or just ignore him. The thread is getting really derailed from cartoons.

Done. Thanks Ride.

I've had my laughs. If he wants to continue talking about his hatred of blacks and feminism, he's got his "The Works of NNewt84" thread to unleash his 'tism storm in.

Anyways, back to cartoons:

Man, looking over Hey Arnold and Doug again made me realize two things again maybe:

1. Hey Arnold was really at its best when the show was about how weird the town is and how weird Arnold was especially. The show really lost something when it transitioned all the way into "Arnold is more or less Jesus who helps everyone else's problems."

2. Doug's creator should've had the chance to do the spinoff for Judy Funnie he wanted to do. She was always much more charismatic and just better all around than Doug. Frankly, Doug was always the worst character in his own show.

It always struck me as weird that we never got more focus on any of the secondary or tertiary cast after Doug ended. I get what Jim was trying to go for - what with having a regular kid dealing with life in this crazy wacky town of literal colorful characters, and maybe he felt that without Doug there to counterbalance it, it'd be too wacky and stray too far from who the show was really about. But he was also sharing a timeslot with Rocko's Modern Life on Nick at the time, a show that basically had a similar concept to Doug that was able to pull it off a lot better, mostly because Rocko wasn't just an audience surrogate and had a lot more personality.

 

[Steamboat_Bill]

It always struck me as weird that we never got more focus on any of the secondary or tertiary cast after Doug ended. I get what Jim was trying to go for - what with having a regular kid dealing with life in this crazy wacky town of literal colorful characters, and maybe he felt that without Doug there to counterbalance it, it'd be too wacky and stray too far from who the show was really about. But he was sharing a timeslot with Rocko's Modern Life on Nick, a show that basically had a similar concept to Doug that was able to pull it off a lot better, mostly because Rocko wasn't just an audience surrogate and had a lot more personality.

After it ended? I don't see how you could focus on the secondary cast then...

But, then again, they didn't really do that in the Disney episodes either.

 

[OmnipotentStupidity]

After it ended? I don't see how you could focus on the secondary cast then...

But, then again, they didn't really do that in the Disney episodes either.

My fault, I should've specified: I was more asking rhethorically why they didn't focus on it after Doug ended the first time around. As in, when it got picked up by Disney, why did they not focus more on them then instead of doing what they ended up doing and creating a worse version of Doug.