Russian Invasion of Ukraine Megathread

[Rezza]

I found it hilarious Ameritards are saying the Ukrainian doesn't have the right to fight for their nation and country, especially when its invaded by an enemy. You people love talking about how you fought the Brits for your freedom, and now you're saying other nations don't have the right to do the same? You burgers are hilarious

 

[Delicious Diversity]

In the last 30 years nations much further away from a great power have been changed on much more specious pretexts than long-time geographic and demographic belonging. That regime change doesn't include territorial annexation but de facto colonial rule and military presence doesn't change what's taken place. A nation state that, as Putin describes it and as you can tell from any given actual Ukrainian statement hinges on being an anti-Russia despite consisting chiefly of Russian speakers and being part of the Russian sphere of influence and that wants to be part of an anti-Russian pact, will not be tolerated by Russia. This isn't some new revelation, experts have been going on about it even when Yeltsin was still around. But yes, on the off chance Vlad cocks up the invasion beyond repair, neutrality through Finlandization could be on the cards if the Russian government hasn't collapsed by that point from going all-in and failing and is thus unable to enforce any kind of deal.

I'd like to know what you mean by "anti-Russian". Do you mean wary of Russian invasion? Hellbent on invading and destroying Russia? Preferring economic ties with the West? Vague dislike of Russia?

I don't buy this idea that Ukrainians hate Russians. Prior to the invasion there was widespread affection and a sense of kinship between Russians and Ukrainians, and on a deeper level, probably still is. What Ukrainians don't like is Putin's government and its actions in annexing Crimea and stoking unrest in the eastern oblasts. They are afraid of Putin, and recent events should make it abundantly clear why.

It seems to me that the majority of Ukrainians (albeit not in the eastern oblasts) supported economic ties with western Europe and that upset Putin. He has created this fear and resentment that he is now using to justify annexing territory and invading the country. I don't believe Ukrainians had any desire for war.

Russia's logic is circular. "We do shit in Ukraine, Ukrainians get mad, oh crap now we have to do more shit in Ukraine because Ukrainians don't like us". And you're buying into that for some reason.

I would say the same about the US in regards to its foreign interventions, but I don't try to justify that.

 

[Pentaborane]

I found it hilarious Ameritards are saying the Ukrainian doesn't have the right to fight for their nation and country, especially when its invaded by an enemy. You people love talking about how you fought the Brits for your freedom, and now you're saying other nations don't have the right to do the same? You burgers are hilarious

The retarded Kwanzanians had most of Europe go and fight their wars for oil as tribute to Washington. Now they get to shut the fuck up and fight for us, or at least make some threatening poses.

 

[Captain Autism69]

Gonna laugh when these idiots' "free republic" gets turned into a puppet state by Putin and they get even more fucked than the rest of Russia.

Like Crimea? Oh wait, life in Crimea became a fuck load better because Kiev didn't give a shit about it before.

 

[H. Bergeron]

I'd like to know what you mean by "anti-Russian". Do you mean wary of Russian invasion? Hellbent on invading and destroying Russia? Preferring economic ties with the West? Vague dislike of Russia?

I don't buy this idea that Ukrainians hate Russians. Prior to the invasion there was widespread affection and a sense of kinship between Russians and Ukrainians, and on a deeper level, probably still is. What Ukrainians don't like is Putin's government and its actions in annexing Crimea and stoking unrest in the eastern oblasts. They are afraid of Putin, and recent events should make it abundantly clear why.

It seems to me that the majority of Ukrainians (albeit not in the eastern oblasts) supported economic ties with western Europe and that upset Putin. He has created this fear and resentment that he is now using to justify annexing territory and invading the country. I don't believe Ukrainians had any desire for war.

Russia's logic is circular. "We do shit in Ukraine, Ukrainians get mad, oh crap now we have to do more shit in Ukraine because Ukrainians don't like us". And you're buying into that for some reason.

I would say the same about the US in regards to its foreign interventions, but I don't try to justify that.

Which then leads to the Ukraine shouldn't have tried to join NATO statement that all the Putin lovers toss around. If NATO hadn't expanded this would never have happened! Those damned Ukranians should know their place.

Yet Russia just showed why all these Eastern European countries want to join NATO in the first place. Look at the difference between Putin's reactions to shit, vs Yeltsin or even Medvedev. Only one of the three chimped out every time one of his old friends joined the cool kids club.

It's why I hate the disingenuous argument of "What if Mexico had a biolab run by the Chinese? Or what if they wanted a security agreement with China?" if the US let relations with Mexico worsen to that degree that they were joining an protective military alliance... that would be on the US at least as much as it would be on Mexico or China, and likely more. Just like Russia has a fuck ton to do with why most of Eastern Europe specifically their former colonies hates them.

 

[The Foldless Brain]

I'd like to know what you mean by "anti-Russian". Do you mean wary of Russian invasion? Hellbent on invading and destroying Russia? Preferring economic ties with the West? Vague dislike of Russia?

I don't buy this idea that Ukrainians hate Russians. Prior to the invasion there was widespread affection and a sense of kinship between Russians and Ukrainians, and on a deeper level, probably still is. What Ukrainians don't like is Putin's government and its actions in annexing Crimea and stoking unrest in the eastern oblasts. They are afraid of Putin, and recent events should make it abundantly clear why.

It seems to me that the majority of Ukrainians (albeit not in the eastern oblasts) supported economic ties with western Europe and that upset Putin. He has created this fear and resentment that he is now using to justify annexing territory and invading the country. I don't believe Ukrainians had any desire for war.

Russia's logic is circular. "We do shit in Ukraine, Ukrainians get mad, oh crap now we have to do more shit in Ukraine because Ukrainians don't like us". And you're buying into that for some reason.

I would say the same about the US in regards to its foreign interventions, but I don't try to justify that.

By having its whole identity hinge on being anti-Russia I mean the Ukrainian government, irrespective of the people who I'd say were neutral to positive on Russia in 2014, lukewarm to negative before the invasion and now negative for at least a generation. The purpose of the Ukrainian government, in the words of Adam Schiff, Lindsay Graham, John McCain, Victoria Nuland and so on is to fight Russia 'over there'.

No one except the Ukrainians cares about the Ukrainian economy. Putin is not scared of the potential of a backward shithole that hasn't moved positively in 8 years and makes even Russia look like Singapore, but by the military and it's the same thing the US cares about. 40 million people present a meaningful demography that an army can be built out of to border Russia, something that isn't the case for any other state bordering Russia right now. Crimea is the only warm water port Russia has and the only one with access to the Black Sea. It already went without water for 8 years after Ukraine dammed it in. A Ukrainian army, which as I was wrong about isn't actually a pushover, would eventually move to take down the separatist regions and Crimea and so seriously weaken Russia while penning it in to being unable to act even in its near abroad.

 

[Jarolleon]

Future Tech has not even been dragged out by either side. Starting a global conflict is a huge gamble for everyone involved. I hope that they can come to some sort of agreement on Ukraine but it seems like this is a fight that is gonna be escalated. Nobody is backing down. Finding out the Germans perfected the Die Glocke or the Russians shooting lasers from space is always some shit that could be on the table when we have been at a standstill for 40 years. Obviously im being hyperbolic but you get the idea.

So Bayraktar didn't actually incinerate the Russian columns? That was just a dumb propaganda song?

I've had some conversations about the cancelling of everything Russian and people are like, "eh whatever, war bad, it's fine." They don't actually think about it.


My experience is people who were all pro-Iraq war, WMDs, pro-torture. Generally lack any hindsight or even process if they were wrong or know what they thought at the time. They have just moved on.

A friend of mine who I used to get in arguments over Iraq, WMDs, torture etc. Did admit he got the WMDs and the war wrong. However he's now all gender is a social construct, orange man bad and some woke stuff. So we have sometimes gotten into arguments again over that. Which was shocking, because I honestly don't know where peers of mine got indoctrinated by the woke shit. None of it was in schools or high education when we went through it.

Did they get it from Tiktok? I suppose that's what they mean by "Lifelong learning" .

 

[H. Bergeron]

Like Crimea? Oh wait, life in Crimea became a fuck load better because Kiev didn't give a shit about it before.

You mean when they kicked out the Tartars and moved in Russians to strengthen their hold on the region. Like they always fucking do? Or was it when they destroyed 1/4 of the Crimean economy by taking it over, hiding who they were like pussies? Or was it when they installed a puppet dictator?

Get the fuck out of here with that nonsense.

 

[Übertroon]

I found it hilarious Ameritards are saying the Ukrainian doesn't have the right to fight for their nation and country, especially when its invaded by an enemy. You people love talking about how you fought the Brits for your freedom, and now you're saying other nations don't have the right to do the same? You burgers are hilarious

Reminder that this is who you're talking to

 

[Hippopatumus]

I found it hilarious Ameritards are saying the Ukrainian doesn't have the right to fight for their nation and country, especially when its invaded by an enemy. You people love talking about how you fought the Brits for your freedom, and now you're saying other nations don't have the right to do the same? You burgers are hilarious

Who is saying that? No seriously, which groups of Americans are saying that?

As a burger I DON'T. GIVE. TWO. FUCKS. ABOUT. UKRAINE. OR RUSSIA. I don't know anybody who does.

 

[kuuu]

Never thought I would do this but I prayed for Putin/Russia to prevail. I am convinced he is on the right side. Russia is taking on The Globohomo and doing the Lord's work. God bless them.

Spoiler: sperg

Thing is, though, Russia would have been doing the same thing if it was as big as western powers. It's all about having a hegemony of USA or having a bipolar world. And the price is lots of civilian lives nobody really cares about until they can be used to push a certain narrative.

---

Was this posted already?

 

[Übertroon]

 

[Willie Thrills]

I'm well aware of the history, and ultimately that very long history lead to an independent Irish Republic. I'd be interested to hear how much you know of the history of Ukrainian nationalism.

Prior to 1900, barely a blip. WWI/Russian Civil War, brief sparks. Interwar, developed strongly in response to Soviet atrocities, but was suppressed.

Post 2014, developed strongly by Western interests, focused on blaming the Russians for Soviet atrocities (despite the fact both Russia and Ukraine were strong parties in favour of Soviet atrocities against other, annexed territories)

 

[No. 7 cat]

You mean when they kicked out the Tartars and moved in Russians to strengthen their hold on the region. Like they always fucking do? Or was it when they destroyed 1/4 of the Crimean economy by taking it over, hiding who they were like pussies? Or was it when they installed a puppet dictator?

Get the fuck out of here with that nonsense.

There are Tatars there still, all those years after Stalin, but less with Russian control. However, the biggest losers were the Pontic Greeks who seem to have been mostly expelled by Stalin, and I doubt the vestigial survivors in Crimea and the coastline will stick the present nonsense. Greece isn't perfect, but less bombs, armed looters, discrimination and war in general.

 

[Narcotics]

Man i thought Zman had coped with the fact that NATO only flirted with ukraine to have even more borders with Russia.
Aren't the gorrillion of sanctions, military equipment, humanitarian aid and Reddit troons that nato has supplied not good enough? It's all they can realistically offer without downright starting ww3.

 

[Kaede Did Nothing Wrong]

the comments are incredible. twitter flipping out on biden like he has canceled the next avengers movie they were promised.

 

[FatalTater]

I found it hilarious Ameritards are saying the Ukrainian doesn't have the right to fight for their nation and country, especially when its invaded by an enemy. You people love talking about how you fought the Brits for your freedom, and now you're saying other nations don't have the right to do the same? You burgers are hilarious

An awful lot of Americans wouldn't lift a finger to protect their own country during the BLM/Antifa riots. You expect any sort of sense to come from those people?

 

[Übertroon]

The Totenkopf patch is the dot over the i of this image

Russia needs to stop invading its neighbors during winter

 

[Reddit Silver]

The GDP per capita in 2013 was 2.6k dollar annually, the highest it ever got since was 2.1k. Fertility sank from 1.5 to 1.2. The Euromaidan and its consequences have been a disaster for the human race and leaving them to be a disgruntled corrupt shithole orbiting Russia would've been better for everyone involved.

There was something else that happend in 2014. Something that could shook Ukrainian economy. I cant put my finger quite on it...

Ah, yeah! Russia took over Crimea and started war with it!

 

[Blake Chortles]

View attachment 3066177
the comments are incredible. twitter flipping out on biden like he has canceled the next avengers movie they were promised.

Well can't get any more unequivocal than that. So essentially every day Ukraine doesn't surrender the blood is on their hands. The terms aren't really unreasonable considering how fucked they are assuming they can't negociate better.