Western Animation - Discuss American, Canadian, and European cartoons here (or just bitch about wokeshit, I guess)

[Trianon]

That... could be horrible.
Shego is an adult in the animation, right? That's why her disguise as a teacher... or not?

Yes, although she was actually qualified to teach - she got a degree in child development. The Kim/Shego ship is inexplicable based on the age gap, but I guess lesbians had to take what they could get.

This is also a show that already got stretched beyond its natural end because season 4 was sort of a surprise demand from the studio after "So the Drama" was supposed to end the series. And you can tell, season 4 is a little off. Still pretty fun, but it tried to introduce a bunch of new elements like Drakken being in jail or Ron/Kim trying to navigate their new romance, and it stumbles a bit. The finale was good though.

I never watched Kim Possible when it was on, because I just dismissed it as a girl's show (though I did watch Teenage Robot and PPG around the same time, go figure). I'm not surprised there's a reboot in the works with how everything is getting rebooted these days.
But I am surprised to learn there was a live action version. Gee, I'm sure this went over well with the older fans.
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The boy has young Justin Timberlake's noodle hair.

The original creators were involved with the live-action movie. I am honestly a diehard fan of the original and I thought it captured the spirit of the show (especially the Drakken and Shego parts). It's got dumb elements, but it's self-aware about them. (I definitely think if you liked MLaaTR you'd like KP. It's super sharp and the world and characters are just so fun.

I would say if the creators are involved, I would be pretty hopeful about it. They are old-school.

-

Regarding Catwoman/Batman, I do like them together mostly because all his other love interests are so, so bad. Everyone in here is rightly complaining that they don't know what to do with Harley, Ivy, or Selina most of the time, but all of those have amazing interpretations compared to Talia al Ghul, who has never been in a good story ever.

The best Joker interpretations are always the ones where he is flat-out in love with Batman, which is a better Catwoman/Batman ship because the stakes are way higher and they are more complete foils who you can argue "created" each other. It doesn't have to be requited at all, but I love when Joker has that soft touch where you're not sure if he's flirting with Batman to make him mad or if he really means it. The Arkham games do this pretty well. And from the clips I've seen of Harley, they ... kinda touch on it?

 

[The Nothingness]

Batman Beyond was and still is amazing. They took an otherwise terrible idea from Warner Bros. (a teenage batman) and turned it into something special.
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And it's intro was kino. You don't see that kind of quality in current animated shows.

 

[Newman's Lovechild]

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I think that mocking adults who like Bluey loses some of its impact when Shadow the Hedgehog is used to do it.

Batman Beyond was and still is amazing. They took an otherwise terrible idea from Warner Bros. (a teenage batman) and turned it into something special.
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I think because it was almost a DC update of Spider-Man, as well as Batman. The Spidey playbook is a tried and tested one. Not to downplay other good decisions it made.

The best Joker interpretations are always the ones where he is flat-out in love with Batman

To an extent. It's one thing that writers picked up from DKR and flanderized, IMO. I prefer it more as 'the Joker is playing a game and Batman's the only other who can play it' rather than 'Joker thirsts for the bat-wang'. See the Batman Beyond 'Return of the Joker' film, where he throws a tantrum because Terry isn't playing the game right.

 

[Oats12345]

I'm shocked that Teen Titans Go will be ten years old in April. I've only seen it a handful of times, but I'll never forget the unbridled, autistic rage it spawned.

Yeah I remember being one of those haters of the show until I realize what the fuck am I doing!!! The show is fine for a kids show I see that now and now that there are stuff like Owl House that exist I realize there are worst things for animation than Teen Titans Go. Funny how the show will be ten years old, Whatever happen to the hate fandom are they still around?

 

[Romeo]

Not sure if this is late or not but you can now watch Warner Bros movies like Osmosis Jones and Cat's Don't Dance on YouTube free with ads. Like The Iron Giant, Warner Bros don't know how to market their animated films (or desperately want their animated films to fail) so they both failed at the box office.

Osmosis Jones

I loved the animation, not the live-action, just as the audience did. Whose bright idea was to get the guys who does R-rated comedies to do the live-action in a children's movie is beyond me, but the animation parts carried the film fluently.

Cats Don't Dance

Animation is superb, but the plot is meh. Anthropomorphic animals are being discriminated against in the film industry thanks to some child and they're trying to break the barrier.

P.S. You can't watch it on Kiwi Farms; you have to watch it on the YouTube website, which is dumb.

 

[Kharash]

No, admittedly:

All of this is a lie. Watch this video to find out why.

So I was browsing though old posts ITT and noticed that this video used as an example of the Owl House being bad had the creator backpedal big time. Gave me a chuckle.

 

[A Grey Cat]

Yeah I remember being one of those haters of the show until I realize what the fuck am I doing!!! The show is fine for a kids show I see that now and now that there are stuff like Owl House that exist I realize there are worst things for animation than Teen Titans Go. Funny how the show will be ten years old, Whatever happen to the hate fandom are they still around?

Yesterday's trash can become today's treasures. If I may quote watchmen the future gets darker and bleaker while the past even the worst of it just looks a bit brighter.


I still remember seeing entire groups on deviantart who's sold purpose was autistically rage at shows like ttg, cartoon network's Mad, and the grandaddy of early 2010s (despite originating in 2005) cartoon hate johnny test.

Those same hate groups probably pine for those shows now, not knowing how bad things can always get.

 

[Basic Blond Boy]

The best Joker interpretations are always the ones where he is flat-out in love with Batman, which is a better Catwoman/Batman ship because the stakes are way higher and they are more complete foils who you can argue "created" each other. It doesn't have to be requited at all, but I love when Joker has that soft touch where you're not sure if he's flirting with Batman to make him mad or if he really means it. The Arkham games do this pretty well. And from the clips I've seen of Harley, they ... kinda touch on it?

I would claim the best Joker adaptations, or the best 70s beyond adaptations, are less a romantic relationship and more so a philosophical debate. Batman and Joker both had ‘one bad day,’ but how their take a ways from said experience are wholly opposed. Batman has this unshakable faith in the system. He believes in Gotham getting better and people’s ability to change. Batman is a man that wants to fix brokenness. Joker sees through the bullshit and believes there is no way to change things, that the best you could do is burn it all down. To some degree, the two actually agree with each other. Batman isn’t stupid, he knows that someone like Pyg or Zazz is incurable and that Joker’s philosophy of just snapping their necks would be a better solution. It is what makes the Arkham Knight dynamic work well. Batman doesn’t take this option though as it ruins what he symbolizes. The same goes for Joker. I believe the Killing Joke shows, to some degree, he believes he can be rehabilitated, yet he doesn’t take the help. He fights it as it ruins his philosophy, choosing to make up bs to skirt around the problem. They are a debate of faith, neither can kill the other as that would be an admission of defeat, they have to get the other to take a leap into their philosophy.

Regarding Catwoman/Batman, I do like them together mostly because all his other love interests are so, so bad. Everyone in here is rightly complaining that they don't know what to do with Harley, Ivy, or Selina most of the time, but all of those have amazing interpretations compared to Talia al Ghul, who has never been in a good story ever.

Wonder Woman works surprisingly well with Bruce and is the only alternative relationship to Bat/Cat that would make sense. That Justice League cartoon really stumbled upon something.

 

[starborn427614]

Not sure if this is late or not but you can now watch Warner Bros movies like Osmosis Jones and Cat's Don't Dance on YouTube free with ads. Like The Iron Giant, Warner Bros don't know how to market their animated films (or desperately want their animated films to fail) so they both failed at the box office.

Osmosis Jones

I loved the animation, not the live-action, just as the audience did. Whose bright idea was to get the guys who does R-rated comedies to do the live-action in a children's movie is beyond me, but the animation parts carried the film fluently.

Cats Don't Dance

Animation is superb, but the plot is meh. Anthropomorphic animals are being discriminated against in the film industry thanks to some child and they're trying to break the barrier.

P.S. You can't watch it on Kiwi Farms; you have to watch it on the YouTube website, which is dumb.

Osmosis Jones is fun, if just for the novelty of the animation contrasting with live action.

 

[Oats12345]

Yesterday's trash can become today's treasures. If I may quote watchmen the future gets darker and bleaker while the past even the worst of it just looks a bit brighter.


I still remember seeing entire groups on deviantart who's sold purpose was autistically rage at shows like ttg, cartoon network's Mad, and the grandaddy of early 2010s (despite originating in 2005) cartoon hate johnny test.

Those same hate groups probably pine for those shows now, not knowing how bad things can always get.

Wait cartoon network's Mad was hated? I loved it.
You know your right Johnny Test wasn't nearly as bad now and days looking back and comparing today stuff

 

[A Grey Cat]

Wait cartoon network's Mad was hated? I loved it.
You know your right Johnny Test wasn't nearly as bad now and days looking back and comparing today stuff

Some people said it's biggest flaw was it couldn't go as far as the printed magazine could in terms of how far they could go. (Ignoring that in the time since the show ended mad got even worse than usual and reality became too much of a parody to be parodied) and that it was cartoon network trying to make robot chicken for kids.

 

[Lone Star]

So I was browsing though old posts ITT and noticed that this video used as an example of the Owl House being bad had the creator backpedal big time. Gave me a chuckle.

I'm glad I dropped him when I did. When he suddenly started to praise the Owl House and have weird autistic shitfits over the Loud House live action stuff, I quickly got out of there.

 

[SecretMagicalGirl]

I get why people have a hate boner with Teen Titans Go, I really do. Yes the original was objectively better. I too wish we could see more instead of Go!

It’s just that People are assuming CN are somehow masochist that are holding back a great show out of pettiness. But in reality the reason is money,

Here’s the thing, Cartoon Network is trying to appeal to little kids, and simply put kids the age they want to reach react better to comedy. That’s why Avatar;Last Airbender, not even in its prime, could get even close to beating Spongebob.

Nostalgic people need to understand why Cartoon Network did this. For one Teen Titans is a 2003 show. It started airing 20 years ago. The kids that all grew with it should be, being extremely generous, young adults by now. Most should be in their 30s.

And they actually did try to bring 2003 Teen Titans back. That was the
plan with their crossover movie. Prove there was interest for it. And they failed miserably. The demand just wasn’t there. As painful it is to say it, for a kid’s network GO! Is the better option because it brings big numbers for their intended demographic,

I too wish we could get more of the original, but it’s not the fault of children’s network wanting kids instead of nostalgic adults. Just look at bronies hijacking a cartoon for little girls.

They would have much better luck it being revived as a streaming show, than convincing a networked that literally just exists for toy commercials to start doing shows for adults.

 

[TheAmbiguousLurker]

See the Batman Beyond 'Return of the Joker' film, where he throws a tantrum because Terry isn't playing the game right.

Still the best Joker defeat for me. The Joker's entire shtick is convincing everyone around him that he's more than just a thug with makeup on, getting by on letting his enemies fill in the blanks of his capabilities and plots; the moment heroes stop taking him seriously he loses all his power and gets knocked on his ass.

 

[Basic Blond Boy]

I get why people have a hate boner with Teen Titans Go, I really do. Yes the original was objectively better. I too wish we could see more instead of Go!

It’s just that People are assuming CN are somehow masochist that are holding back a great show out of pettiness. But in reality the reason is money,

Here’s the thing, Cartoon Network is trying to appeal to little kids, and simply put kids the age they want to reach react better to comedy. That’s why Avatar;Last Airbender, not even in its prime, could get even close to beating Spongebob.

Nostalgic people need to understand why Cartoon Network did this. For one Teen Titans is a 2003 show. It started airing 20 years ago. The kids that all grew with it should be, being extremely generous, young adults by now. Most should be in their 30s.

And they actually did try to bring 2003 Teen Titans back. That was the
plan with their crossover movie. Prove there was interest for it. And they failed miserably. The demand just wasn’t there. As painful it is to say it, for a kid’s network GO! Is the better option because it brings big numbers for their intended demographic,

I too wish we could get more of the original, but it’s not the fault of children’s network wanting kids instead of nostalgic adults. Just look at bronies hijacking a cartoon for little girls.

They would have much better luck it being revived as a streaming show, than convincing a networked that literally just exists for toy commercials to start doing shows for adults.

Take this with a grain of salt, but there was a rumor I recall seeing that explained why Titans ended and Go happened, and honestly, it makes sense. The rumor goes that the show had an audience mismatch and CN struggled to market to the audience of Teen Titans. When developing the show, they expected an audience of 7-10 year old boys, so the show would get by on toy sales from that demographic. The issue was that the show was written very much in the style of a CW teen drama and used an anime aesthetic. By the end, they found the show was attracting teenage-college age women. This trend would persist with Young Justice, which tried Titans again, but ended up with the same pitfalls.

With this wildly unexpected audience, CN couldn’t generate merchandise revenue like they needed for the shows to continue as what teenage girl would buy products with cartoon capeshit on it? I would question the rumor, but Teen Titans is sort of an early Tumblr staple, so I am a little more inclined to believe it is probably true to some degree.

TTG was designed as a kiddy series from day one to avoid the issues of TT and YJ. Rather than market to boys, CN went for a young demographic, and it worked. Kids bought a lot of TTG shit and the community didn’t become overrun with older audiences.

 

[Prophetic Spirit]

By the end, they found the show was attracting teenage-college age women.

Nah, i don't accept that.
Until this day the Go! (the comics with the same aethestic as the 2003 cartoon) had basically the entire fandom divided into nostalgic fags and the coomers.
Jesus, even the NSFW flash parodies appeared in the same segment and in the same era.
So, attracting women is a partial lie. This cartoon spawned a whole new segment of coomers, mainly Raven.

 

[Basic Blond Boy]

Nah, i don't accept that.
Until this day the Go! (the comics with the same aethestic as the 2003 cartoon) had basically the entire fandom divided into nostalgic fags and the coomers.
Jesus, even the NSFW flash parodies appeared in the same segment and in the same era.
So, attracting women is a partial lie. This cartoon spawned a whole new segment of coomers, mainly Raven.

I do wonder, but to add more merit, this was not the first CN property I have heard that from. Remember FusionFall? That game also had the same problem mentioned for it in a facts video, as apparently 37% of the community was comprised of them, if the user is to be believed.

I definitely think there is at least a truth to the idea that Teen Titans was mainly watched by people outside the toy age range. I also believe a much higher percentage of the community was compromised of college women than we would normally expect

 

[A Grey Cat]

So if bluey is still relevant tge oldest pitch pilot for it has been found, and yes it is getting discussed by fans all over youtube.
Basically it's a minute long short meant to pitch the idea of the show.

So from I can gather the original idea was "it's a show about why millennials (the oldest ones in 2015 anyways) are making terrible parents." When that got rejected the show was tweaked to make the parents slightly older just on the line between millennial and Gen x, and given better personalities. As in making them responsible parents who are willing to drop what their doing to play along with whatever wacky games their kids come up on the fly.


I gotta be honest for all the shit we've been giving this show I'd hate to see what it would have been had the original idea in this pitch pilot wasn't rejected.

 

[Rome's rightful successor]

Take this with a grain of salt, but there was a rumor I recall seeing that explained why Titans ended and Go happened, and honestly, it makes sense. The rumor goes that the show had an audience mismatch and CN struggled to market to the audience of Teen Titans. When developing the show, they expected an audience of 7-10 year old boys, so the show would get by on toy sales from that demographic. The issue was that the show was written very much in the style of a CW teen drama and used an anime aesthetic. By the end, they found the show was attracting teenage-college age women. This trend would persist with Young Justice, which tried Titans again, but ended up with the same pitfalls.

With this wildly unexpected audience, CN couldn’t generate merchandise revenue like they needed for the shows to continue as what teenage girl would buy products with cartoon capeshit on it? I would question the rumor, but Teen Titans is sort of an early Tumblr staple, so I am a little more inclined to believe it is probably true to some degree.

TTG was designed as a kiddy series from day one to avoid the issues of TT and YJ. Rather than market to boys, CN went for a young demographic, and it worked. Kids bought a lot of TTG shit and the community didn’t become overrun with older audiences.

How would a TV channel before the streaming age figure out the demographics of it's viewers?

 

[SteelPlatedHeart]

Something is going on with the new Proud Family, because I see people arguing about it all over Twitter.