Final Fantasy XIV - Kiwi Free Company

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I don't have a lot of experience playing BLM (I level it to cap and forget about it), but my guess is that many people who try leveling BLM, especially if doing only roulettes to level, get confused/annoyed by the rotation changing every time they sync down. I think that, more than anything, contributes to the perception that BLM is a super-complicated class that requires 12D chess to master.

SMN is magic machinist. The only things the pet matters for is whether the SMN can pop their shield, and how quickly some abilities go off. Both of those considerations are pretty easy to play around: pop your shield before a trance/pet transformation if you know you'll be eating an AE, and try to stay close to the mob to minimize how long it takes for a pet to explode.

I think SMN being so much more straight-forward and mobile than BLM also contributes to the perception that BLM is amazingly complicated.

edit: clarity
 
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I'm just a casual BLM enjoyer, but what makes me MATI is the fact that they had a job that allowed for a stupid amount of ways to press all the buttons, and, despite all the autism, it all "just worked", automagically, yielding a significant chance to fuck things up for a coulple more % of DPS. As it should be. And all the non-standard shit wasn't even required to clear content, but it was still really fun to try (and sometimes fail) using it.

I'm wondering if they have some new guy who was trying to "improve" things, but didn't realize that all the BLM stuff is actually so fragile, that something as simple (and pointless) as adding a new damage button at the end of the fire phase (seriously, WTF is the point of the Flare Star, other than to punish people for missing a F4, which is really easy now that the Enochian is effectively down from 15 to 12 seconds), or trading Sharpcast for auto-procs (that work suspiciously like Paradox, and everyone remembers the Paradox loop), will lead to changing even more stuff. The mana regen is actually retarded, though. It was never *that* big of an issue, but if they wanted to fix it, they could've just reused the Enochian code they already have to decouple mana regen from server ticks, but instead they decided to do *this*.
 
If you haven't seen it yet, I recommend watching Preach's interview of Yoshi-P for the media tour. It's the best interview out there imo that goes more into the design philosophy and the thought process that goes into why they make some of the choices they make as opposed to just only speaking about Dawntrail. (Apparently according to Preach, Yoshi enjoyed their conversation so much that he invited him out to eat afterwards so they could talk more.)

 
So, I'm reinstalling FFXIV and am about to do the first pre-order of my life with Dawntrail (I'm convinced I'll buy it in the future, why not grab the XP earrings while I'm at it). Honestly feeling hype at this point, especially for the new Jobs. Going to be a bit dumb of me to ask, how did I gear up in post-patches again? Do I run the patch dungeons over and over? I remember my main Job being geared with 6.3 stuff.
 
If you’ve got any tomestones of poetics lying around you should be able to trade them for the most upgraded form of the current tomestone of comedy gear once dawntrail hits. You could also trade the crafted 6.3 gear in for tokens for upgraded versions of that in Radz. At this point though, I’d just stack up on poetics if you’re not already capped and do the first option in a few weeks.
 
I'm just a casual BLM enjoyer, but what makes me MATI is the fact that they had a job that allowed for a stupid amount of ways to press all the buttons, and, despite all the autism, it all "just worked", automagically, yielding a significant chance to fuck things up for a coulple more % of DPS. As it should be. And all the non-standard shit wasn't even required to clear content, but it was still really fun to try (and sometimes fail) using it.

I'm wondering if they have some new guy who was trying to "improve" things, but didn't realize that all the BLM stuff is actually so fragile, that something as simple (and pointless) as adding a new damage button at the end of the fire phase (seriously, WTF is the point of the Flare Star, other than to punish people for missing a F4, which is really easy now that the Enochian is effectively down from 15 to 12 seconds), or trading Sharpcast for auto-procs (that work suspiciously like Paradox, and everyone remembers the Paradox loop), will lead to changing even more stuff. The mana regen is actually retarded, though. It was never *that* big of an issue, but if they wanted to fix it, they could've just reused the Enochian code they already have to decouple mana regen from server ticks, but instead they decided to do *this*.
I really believe that most issues with job design are the result of encounter design. Against a striking dummy boss you leave no room for rotations that aren't optimized DPS. When everything is predictable on a timeline, when the boss doesn't move and be hit from anywhere in the arena, and you have no other targets, that doesn't leave room for any kind of expression or risk. If we want job designs that aren't the same optimized rotation every single time we need a variety of fights that have different challanges where suboptimal DPS is ok.

What if there was a fight where you had to control how quickly you burned the boss or you would take too much damage or spawn too many adds? What about a boss that is highly mobile and uptime is never guaranteed? What if there were other interactive elements in the arena that require attention? Gameplay is so static that I started using a plugin to execute my rotation for me. Call me a cheater if you want but I've been pressing the same buttons in the same order for years and the only time I will do anything different is switching from aoe in dungeons to single target in boss fights. Mashing a bunch of filler skills on GNB starts to feel pointless after a while. 99% of mechanics are only about where you are standing anyways and has nothing to do with any skills you use.

I think this is where the job design team fails so hard. They don't understand that a job's actual spells and skills don't matter. You could condense everything to one button and the game doesn't change. They are trying to keep interest by adding more bloat or extending rotations, but it doesn't make the game any more fun if the changes still mean there is only one correct way to play a job. But the boss designers aren't willing to change their strategy either and think that a new boss is changing the pattern on the floor.
 
Going to be a bit dumb of me to ask, how did I gear up in post-patches again? Do I run the patch dungeons over and over? I remember my main Job being geared with 6.3 stuff.
If you want ilvl 660 stuff, you farm Comedy tomestones (caps at 900 per week atm), buy 650 stuff, and farm the 3 alliance raids for coins to buy Divine Shine/Twine to augment it.

If you were up-to-date with Manderville, keep going with that so you can get the 665 relic weapon. 1500 Causality tomestones per upgrade isn't too bad.

edit- The last alliance raid drops 650 armor. Like Ravana said, with DT coming in two and a half weeks, you may not want to bother spending comedy doing the current purchase/upgrade path. If I were in your shoes, I would upgrade the relic weapon to cap, try to get Theogonic armor from the last alliance raid, and pentameld crafted accessories till DT.
 
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confused/annoyed by the rotation changing every time they sync down.
Oh yeah, for sure, but it used to be way worse. There was a specific level range where Freeze was the only AoE spell you used because it out-performed everything else, and then it abruptly swapped over to F2/Flare. There was a range where you had to ensure you didn't burn all of your mana on F4 casts, because B3 wasn't yet free to cast in AF, and then it suddenly became free.

As it stands now, the rotation is basically the same from 60 onwards. Level 50 content feels like dogshit on BLM, but I dropped any CT raids the second they loaded anyways.
WTF is the point of the Flare Star
Adding something without actually adding something.
Enochian is effectively down from 15 to 12 seconds
Yeah. And not just due to flare star. Whereas you can currently do a fire start (swiftcast F3 -> thunder -> burn through MP faster before ice), you now have to do an ice start.

But from my understanding of the thunderhead changes, you only get it when you swap between AF and UI - which means that your rotation would now be B3->B4->F3->Thunderhead, meaning that first pass is also now 12 seconds, and to offset this you'll need to eat a tick on the end of thunder to start placing it during UI.
they could've just reused the Enochian code they already have to decouple mana regen from server ticks
This is a change I would actually fucking love, but it's not as sexy as talking about new abilities or passives. The whole reason that Lucid Dreaming is used in that weird transpose line is because while you -can- reach 10K MP without it, you're dependent on the mercy of server ticks for the last 1K. Without lucid, it sometimes works out... and sometimes forces you to drift a half-second. If this shit were standardized away from server ticks, it would make it so much easier to avoid clipping F4s.
 
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But from my understanding of the thunderhead changes, you only get it when you swap between AF and UI - which means that your rotation would now be B3->B4->F3->Thunderhead, meaning that first pass is also now 12 seconds, and to offset this you'll need to eat a tick on the end of thunder to start placing it during UI.
Unless they're going to change it again, Thunderhead also procs when switching from unaspected to UI/AF. Doesn't really matter though, because Flare Star requires 6 F4's, and stacks drop when switching between UI/AF, so B3-B4-F3-... opener is pretty much forced now.

I really believe that most issues with job design are the result of encounter design.
Simplifying either job or boss mechanics to make balancing not a complete nightmare is reasonable, but now they're doing both, to a degree it's just lazy. They could've done something more than "hit it 'till it dies". Hell, even the tutorial had the "pull the switch to stop enemy reinforcements". Some environmental stuff could be neat. Something like "you can drop that giant rock on top of the boss, which does a lot of damage, but makes fight harder, because part of the arena is now inaccessible", but stuff like that requires a decent amount of effort, and it seems like the way they add difficulty is by tightening the DPS checks, so bosses pretty much have to be turned into glorified target dummies. Which is fine, but it does get old eventually.

Gameplay is so static that I started using a plugin to execute my rotation for me.
I'd say the fact that such a plugin even exists and is actually usable is the game's problem, not the players'. In a similar vein, my personal peeve is the way they convey certain mechanics (P10S's stack/spread comes to mind) where they use party de/buffs instead of just placing a dorito on top of you, so you now have to watch the party list instead of focusing on what's actually happening on the screen, and the game turns into "parse the UI".
 
SMN is magic machinist. The only things the pet matters for is whether the SMN can pop their shield, and how quickly some abilities go off. Both of those considerations are pretty easy to play around: pop your shield before a trance/pet transformation if you know you'll be eating an AE, and try to stay close to the mob to minimize how long it takes for a pet to explode.

I think SMN being so much more straight-forward and mobile than BLM also contributes to the perception that BLM is amazingly complicated.
BLM has always been the most mobile caster when played correctly. Aetherial Manipulation, Between the Lines, triplecast etc. Summoner and Red Mage, despite having short casts, both have faux melee phases which means they'll always be less mobile than a pure ranged caster.

BLM's perception problem is not really due to anything with summoner though. Pre-EW SMN was anything but straightforward but it still got a fair bit of mindshare. I think what gives BLM its reputation is that it simply isn't fun to play while leveling and most people never got it past HW levels.
 
BLM has always been the most mobile caster when played correctly. Aetherial Manipulation, Between the Lines, triplecast etc. Summoner and Red Mage, despite having short casts, both have faux melee phases which means they'll always be less mobile than a pure ranged caster.

BLM's perception problem is not really due to anything with summoner though. Pre-EW SMN was anything but straightforward but it still got a fair bit of mindshare. I think what gives BLM its reputation is that it simply isn't fun to play while leveling and most people never got it past HW levels.
When I am playing healer, I infrequently see BLM who excel. It does happen, but at a rate of like 20% or less of BLM that I see. The biggest problem with those BLM who do not excel? Dying to mechanics they could avoid by moving. If there are tools for mobility that the majority of players do not or cannot master, how useful are those tools? Granted, some of the terrible 80% of BLM players I see don't die, they are just awful DPS.

SMN has these problems much less frequently. So maybe I should say the straight-forward playstyle of the SMN enables a less-skilled player to be more mobile and successful as a DPS overall? There is definitely a difference in both skill floor and skill ceiling between current SMN and BLM, and I do think people tend to group the classes together in their mind since they are both 2.0 casters, despite modern SMN having little in common with 2.0 SMN.

As for RDM, like Burger Kings and Hrothgar, they are either absolute dogshit or amazing, with no mediocre players to be seen. I wish I knew why that is the way it is.
 
Gameplay is so static that I started using a plugin to execute my rotation for me
This is lame. The point isn't that the rotation is hard, it's executing the rotation while following mechs is difficult. Taking half of that out of the equation is lame - I guarantee if you plug your stuff into XIVAnalysis (before cheats) you weren't executing everything perfectly with 0 downtime. Getting gud at that while memorizing the mechs is the game. I don't even know why you'd play the game with that, it's basically just a dodging simulator without performing job actions.

I'd say the fact that such a plugin even exists and is actually usable is the game's problem, not the players'.
Is an aimbot in an FPS the games problem? I'm not sure if you are arguing for better anti-cheat to reduce plugins or saying that static rotations lead to plugins for them. The former I agree with, the latter I don't get.
 
This is lame. The point isn't that the rotation is hard, it's executing the rotation while following mechs is difficult. Taking half of that out of the equation is lame - I guarantee if you plug your stuff into XIVAnalysis (before cheats) you weren't executing everything perfectly with 0 downtime. Getting gud at that while memorizing the mechs is the game. I don't even know why you'd play the game with that, it's basically just a dodging simulator without performing job actions.
Maybe, but again if I am performing the same rotation every time against every enemy that isn't fun. It's just busywork that I'm obligated to do with no real incentive to improve. For sure I don't execute my rotation perfectly but so what if I do or don't? The game isn't going to change other than maybe the boss dies a few seconds sooner. With bosses being nothing more than striking dummies executing my rotation against them is just as easy in dungeons as it is in raids. I alter literally nothing about what I do other than where I stand in the arena. I don't have to worry about uptime, I don't alter my rotation to use different skills, my buffs always go off at the same time, and nothing the party does changes that either. FFXIV IS a dodging simulator and that's my problem with the game and why I was hoping Dawntrail might change that. Sadly they did not, but at least Yoshi seems to understand that it is an issue.

As was said before if the game even allows that to be a viable strategy to macro your entire rotation that is a fault in the game design. It's strange that fishing and crafting understand the benefit of reactionary gameplay but the core combat doesn't, at least not outside of basic healing.
 
Well, while I wait for maintenance to finish up I'll regale you all with a little anecdote:

Back when I was first going through 2.0 I originally thought the whole primal summoning thing was just the arc storyline of the base game, and that the future installments would move the story away from that to something more interesting Afterall, reducing your entire cosmology to glorified tulpas is just silly! Why would the writers spend hours writing up all this indepth lore for each god, and then place it on a foundation of "none of this is real even in our play pretend world, it's all just aether"? And then I kept playing and turns out, nope, it's all just anime string theory, all the way down.

I was going through the encyclopedia eorzias, and while normally the cosmology and and world building portions of these kinds of books are my favorite parts, my eyes just glaze over when I get to those sections here. It's all just "Aetheraetheraether, aetheraether, aetheraetheraether. Aether." All gods are just aether. So are people and everything else. How are they different? Fuck you, that's how. It's all so... flat? Reductive? Vapid? There's nothing of substance here.

It's annoying because I find this kind of trope prevelant in more and more stories and I'm really baffled as to where it's coming from. I was under the impression it was a DnD thing everyone just copied.
 
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Speaking of donating to the Trevor Project, I've noticed that Mr. Happy has become the doomer meme.
 
Well, while I wait for maintenance to finish up I'll regale you all with a little anecdote:

Back when I was first going through 2.0 I originally thought the whole primal summoning thing was just the arc storyline of the base game, and that the future installments would move the story away from that to something more interesting Afterall, reducing your entire cosmology to glorified tulpas is just silly! Why would the writers spend hours writing up all this indepth lore for each god, and then place it on a foundation of "none of this is real even in our play pretend world, it's all just aether"? And then I kept playing and turns out, nope, it's all just anime string theory, all the way down.

I was going through the encyclopedia eorzias, and while normally the cosmology and and world building portions of these kinds of books are my favorite parts, my eyes just glaze over when I get to those sections here. It's all just "Aetheraetheraether, aetheraether, aetheraetheraether. Aether." All gods are just aether. So are people and everything else. How are they different? Fuck you, that's how. It's all so... flat? Reductive? Vapid? There's nothing of substance here.

It's annoying because I find this kind of trope prevelant in more and more stories and I'm really baffled as to where it's coming from. I was under the impression it was a DnD thing everyone just copied.
Aether is the end-all and be-all! Nothing can beat it! Wait, here's a thing called dynamis, it is so much weaker than aether. How do we beat aether? With dynamis!

Oh but dynamis can be stronger cause more people had the feels at once, so even though the WoL is a brick shithouse of aether, nope dynamis can be stronger!

I'm already trying to expunge a lot of EW from my brain because everything from Palaka's Stand on is fucking retarded. Even though I liked the Ascians, Yoshi's speech to the player in Elpis was cringe and Meteion is retarded. "I'm so sad I am become Death, Destroyer of Worlds." :story:

Also, every time Y'shtola feeds something her aether, she should go blind.
 
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Unless they're going to change it again, Thunderhead also procs when switching from unaspected to UI/AF.
Oh? Sweet. I only was reading from the tooltips, which don't explain that unaspected -> aspected counts. So that's a relief, and flare star is just the odd stickout.
I think what gives BLM its reputation is that it simply isn't fun to play while leveling and most people never got it past HW levels.
I can wholly agree with this. I bought a skip on mine precisely because it was such dogshit (and because I don't really enjoy doing leveling content where I can't be tank or healer and speed up otherwise fucking slow single-pulling mouth-breathers). Pre-50, the class barely functions and can barely be said to have a rotation.
Dying to mechanics they could avoid by moving
This is a part of "I heard the meme, and I decided that it must apply to me." There are certain AoEs that you can just put up the shield and eat to keep up your uptime, especially during Leyline. If you have a pocket healer you can rely on not to be retarded, having one (sometimes even two) vuln stacks isn't a big deal on certain encounters.

But all of these are things you need to know ahead of time. Otherwise, you are much better served by cancelling your cast, pressing triplecast, and just blasting while repositioning.
If there are tools for mobility that the majority of players do not or cannot master, how useful are those tools?
Well, if the majority of people don't know how to repair their cars, should we take away the ability of people who learn how to do that?

It's one thing when they're really arcane or bizarre, but BLM's mobility tools are really simple. Swiftcast and triplecast are a simple button press, whereas the teleport-to-someone involves selecting your focus target (or using the function keys to target someone) and then a button-press, with the teleport-to-leyline ability also being a button press. Xenoglossy, Thunderhead, Firestarter, and the soon-to-die Ice-Paradox are all instant-casts that let you move around while you use them. Slidecasting is the only complicated portion of mobility, but for the vast majority of people you really don't need to know how to do it.
Granted, some of the terrible 80% of BLM players I see don't die, they are just awful DPS.
Which is the same reason as it is for other classes: people just freestyling and pushing random buttons because they're actually watching netflix.
So the person who was spamming their 'donate to the Trevor Project!' message has stopped doing it, so I'd say that it is successful.
Here I was hoping you'd have a precedent to use in order to start asking people to donate to some other countervailingly stupid political movement.
It's annoying because I find this kind of trope prevelant in more and more stories and I'm really baffled as to where it's coming from.
It's just a sign of bad writing, which tends to get far in write-by-committee. FF14 (very obviously) has a rotating cast of creatives, and there are sections - like Bozja - where emphasis is taken away from "stupid magical crystal dust" and instead put onto more grounded political machinations. But so soon as that arrives, hand-waving nonsense must come in to explain why X-Y-Z nonsensical thing that conveniently closes a plothole has occurred.

It's a crutch you keep around because if you stay consistently mediocre, people won't really care when your output continues to be mediocre.
 
Well, if the majority of people don't know how to repair their cars, should we take away the ability of people who learn how to do that?
I don't take my car to be serviced by people who don't know how to repair it, but I still wind up with BLM getting clobbered by sea serpents in Thaliea because they think standing in their Ley Lines is top DPS even though they die. Aetherial Manipulation is an easier movement ability to use than Shukuchi for ninjas, but I see ninjas teleporting all the time, and many BLM seem to be happy to drop dead. There's something about that BLM skill floor and skill ceiling.

Maybe it's just my DC? Crystal does seem to be pretty retarded a lot of the time.
 
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