Alternate History - Thing happened in real life, so what if thing NOT happened?

[Ughubughughughughughghlug]

What if Pepsi kept its navy that it bought from the Soviets, but had armaments to put on it, and used it to build a maritime filibuster empire in Polynesia and rename it Pepsinesia?

 

[Ishtar]

Early modern post apocalypse.

A catastrophic plague spreads across the world circa 1640. Wiping out anywhere from 40 to 70% of the population.

By 1655 the world is utterly changed. European cities are deserted, fields left fallow. Silver mines in Peru are gaping pits in the mountains, the Ottoman palace is decaying into ruins, while China is haunted by warlords and revived feudalism, even Mongol raids.

This plague let's say some sort of airborne influenza spares no one by age, wiping out peasant populations, dynasties and armies on campaign.

A lot of early modern European states collapse into their pre existing feudal structures, and the Ming Dynasty is pretty much destroyed. The Ottomans are still around, though their manpower reserves in the Balkans and Anatolia are gone, with the Safavids now marching to Damascus. The Ottoman bey in charge of Egypt has revolted.

Western Europe was particularly hard hit, with France descending into civil war and anarchy, as protestants, self interested nobles, and surviving loyalists of Louis XIV(who himself died) fight in the rubble. England is under no crown or Commonwealth, London is barely even habitable.

The Spanish Empire however lost up to 97% of its population, in the Americas and Spain itself. Neo-conquistadors are pretty much operating on their own, as native populations whether the devastation seeking independence.

Mughal India is gone, now reduced Hindu and Muslim petty kingdoms fight over it. Technological progress has taken a massive step backwards. As labor for ships, the importation of raw materials, and the flow of ideas has nearly ceased. European colonization in the Americas isn't over, but they are all pretty much on their own.

Poland-Lithuania whethered the plague better and is expanding into ravaged Germany, with countless peasants welcoming them warmly. Muscovy and Eastern Europe were hit later, and have done a little better. But Novgorod is a deserted city with a town inside it.

The power of the Church has gotten a massive boost, and protestant states have been especially hard hit. So Europe's march towards secular states that we see begin to form in the 18th century is hampered if not prevented.

By 1660, the plague dies down, except for outbreaks reaching more remote areas such as Central Asia, the interior of North America, and Australia and the interior of Africa.


Now its up for the petty lords, bishop princes and merchant notables to forge new dynasties and empires.

 

[Ughubughughughughughghlug]

What if during the Age of Exploration there were bull-sized sea-moths that flew around eating the sails off of sailing ships?

 

[Karakhalkin-Gol]

What if during the Age of Exploration there were bull-sized sea-moths that flew around eating the sails off of sailing ships?

Muskets would be introduced onboard to combat them. Their effectiveness is debatable.

 

[Ishtar]

I like the idea of extending conflicts as long as reasonably possible. Here are a few ideas.

WW1 goes into 1919-not sure how long it could last with Germany on the ropes and her allies getting knocked out of the conflict, maybe an earlier POD could prolong things. But Plan 1919 could be interesting, especially if the Allies make a push deeper into Germany.
WW2-extending the war in Europe is hard, an Axis victory is probably before 1945. Maybe the Allies bungle Normandy and the Soviets are held in Poland longer? Prolonging the war till later 1945 and into 1946. Best case performance for Japan in Downfall-leading to the war in the Pacific lasting until 1948.
Napoleonic era-Napoleon wins at Leipzig or otherwise holds off the allies. The war of the Sixth coalition is delayed. Super unlikely but total victory at Waterloo prolongs the war of the seventh coalition...maybe a few months later? Assuming Napoleon rolls sixes it might last another year or so.

WW3 conventional fighting throughout Europe-war continues after nuclear weapons are used.

 

[Rome's rightful successor]

What if the Cold War never ended and the eastern block never fell?

 

[Black Man Underwear]

Spoiler: The boringest WW2 ever

Hitler wins WW2, IMO only plausible if Lindbergh becomes President. Lindbergh doesn't lend-lease to the UK or USSR because of the friendship between the US and Germany. He possibly pressures the UK to avoid interference in WW2. The war is between Germany and Poland, then Germany and France. Operation Barbarossa is a separate war entirely.

Germany wins all 3 wars because they never fight on more than 1 front, but the Soviets have to deal with 2 fronts and no allies shipping them weapons. Norway is never occupied because Britain never enters the war, and Italy holds some territories in North Africa and Eastern Europe. The "crusade against Bolshevism" is very brief, and Germany creates an EU. Britain warms up to Germany because of American influence. A Jewish homeland in Madagascar is established by 1955.

Asia is ignored by the world, Japan probably loses the war against China but without American intervention the Japanese hold on to some land in China. Japanese Manchukuo and the ROC stick around, while the CCP probably collapses because they are the poorest chinkies and the last real communist nation on Earth. The Qing might return by 1970 something.

There is no Cold War because America went down an isolationist route and the UK has a powerful trading partner. Proxy wars in Asia don't happen and would serve no purpose anyway. The most eventful incidents after this time are probably in post Soviet Russia, which is bouncing between democracy, monarchy, and dictatorship, and Africa, which is dealing with the fallout of colonialism.

After 1960 something nothing interesting happens. There is no invasion of the US. This timeline isn't very fun.

 

[Ishtar]

ASB Idea:

The Napoleonic Empire excluding French client states in 1809(just mainline France basically, also the netherlands) are transported back in time to the War of Spanish succession. About a century in the past.

Napoleon and the Grand Armee now have a century's technological advantage over early 18th century Europe. Once word reaches the French and Napoleon of the civilization, he'll take as divine will to take Europe.

The British at this time do not have near the same power at sea, (though the Royal navy is probably still larger) the German states are more firmly under Austria's grasp and Prussia's rise has barely begun, with Sweden having been defeated recently by Russia. British North America is far less populated and french colonies in the new world remain strong.

Napoleon can probably get rid of the HRE, though he won't be able to invade Britain. Spain and the Bourbons are something of a problem, also Enlightenment ideals have only barely begun to emerge so there will be much more resistance once they begin to circulate again.

My knowledge of early 18th century Europe is not as good as I'd like, but its an interesting place to put Napoleon in. Obviously the Grand Armee is going to be smashing any real force that opposes it for a long while. Given the century of evolution in technology, organization, drill, etc...

 

[Curzon Dax-sama]

What if the Cold War never ended and the eastern block never fell?

Quite based things would occur. The US and the west in general wouldn't become a fake, gay and retarded version of the USSR, for instance. Chyna would remain irrelevant. Japan would continue to produce comfy animes. Best Korean moonlanding in 2030.

 

[Ughubughughughughughghlug]

Why did I have to be born into this shitty world where the Golden Circle doesn't exist?

 

[PipTheAlchemist]

What if Pepsi kept its navy that it bought from the Soviets, but had armaments to put on it, and used it to build a maritime filibuster empire in Polynesia and rename it Pepsinesia?

Pepsi ethnostate gets founded.

 

[EpicGamerMoment]

A “WWII” alt history idea I never see explored is one where Nazis rise to power in Germany yet the war either doesn’t happen or the Nazis don’t start it.

Hitler stops after demanding Memel. And Poland and Germany come to an agreement over Danzig (somehow). What would a world with a “Peaceful” Nazi Germany look like ?

 

[JJLiautaud]

Hitler stops after demanding Memel. And Poland and Germany come to an agreement over Danzig (somehow). What would a world with a “Peaceful” Nazi Germany look like ?

Germany defaults and the Nazis are ousted from power, in the confusion Commies invade the Baltics and Poland while the world stands by and watches.

 

[Ughubughughughughughghlug]

what if Janet Reno had served under Custer at Little Bighorn instead of Marcus Reno?

 

[JJLiautaud]

what if Janet Reno had served under Custer at Little Bighorn instead of Marcus Reno?

Somehow more children wouldve died.

 

[Ughubughughughughughghlug]

A “WWII” alt history idea I never see explored is one where Nazis rise to power in Germany yet the war either doesn’t happen or the Nazis don’t start it.

Hitler stops after demanding Memel. And Poland and Germany come to an agreement over Danzig (somehow). What would a world with a “Peaceful” Nazi Germany look like ?

Like Francoist Spain, meaning horrific shithole. Autarky is a disaster for a country. Nations trade because it allows them to reap the same benefits of specialization that motivate the division of labor among individuals. In Spain their economy never recovered from the Spanish Civil War until Franco liberalized, basically handed the reins over to some economists (organization called Opus Dei, Catholic laymen) who went hardcore capitalist (like Pinochet did with the Chicago Boys) and they transitioned to a tourism economy.

In this case it's not as dire since Germany presumably has the CHOICE of trade and hasn't burned their country down, but if the Nazis are Nazis then they're going to experiment with autarky... Another consequence of fascism in Spain was very high inequality (corporatism is a hell of a drug).

German culture, ironically (for all the Nazi wannabe fuckwads that have come to infest this site), probably comes out of it all devastated since Hitler had a hateboner for anything that didn't match HIS vision of Germany and wanted to gut Christianity and turn it into an empty vessel for party propaganda. You wind up with a Germany that just looks like a postcard but has no spirit behind it.

Eventually their system ends when the people in charge mellow out and the economy gets so bad that people rise against it, peacefully or otherwise. Germany shapes up to be, perhaps, like Argentina: a nation that should have been first-rate and is instead second-rate because it traded its future away.

The big winner may, ironically, be the Soviet Union. As I understand (could be wrong, tell me if I am) they actually spent more holding down Eastern Europe than they gained. It was strategic, protect themselves. If this is a peaceful Germany I figure the Soviets just chug along in their own borders, maybe they even get a transition (like China) to markets without having to give up the Party.

 

[JJLiautaud]

Like Francoist Spain, meaning horrific shithole. Autarky is a disaster for a country. Nations trade because it allows them to reap the same benefits of specialization that motivate the division of labor among individuals. In Spain their economy never recovered from the Spanish Civil War until Franco liberalized, basically handed the reins over to some economists (organization called Opus Dei, Catholic laymen) who went hardcore capitalist (like Pinochet did with the Chicago Boys) and they transitioned to a tourism economy.

This ignores the fact that Germany had to invade when it did because of all the beyond Hollywood tier creative accounting they did, thus they would've had to start making very hard decisions by 1940 1943 at the latest

 

[Johan Schmidt]

Eventually their system ends when the people in charge mellow out and the economy gets so bad that people rise against it, peacefully or otherwise. Germany shapes up to be, perhaps, like Argentina: a nation that should have been first-rate and is instead second-rate because it traded its future away.

Nah. Himmler would have 100% plunged that country into a civil war. The man was the platonic embodiment of a used car salesman. He amassed power so fast, and so unopposed that there's no way he wasn't going to do something if Germany didn't do the whole 'European Union' thing. With no external war, he'd have either had someone try and check the power that his multiple organisations were swiftly building, or he would have looked around and gone 'Why not be chancellor lol?'.

 

[Phalanges Mycologist]

Nah. Himmler would have 100% plunged that country into a civil war. The man was the platonic embodiment of a used car salesman. He amassed power so fast, and so unopposed that there's no way he wasn't going to do something if Germany didn't do the whole 'European Union' thing. With no external war, he'd have either had someone try and check the power that his multiple organisations were swiftly building, or he would have looked around and gone 'Why not be chancellor lol?'.

Honestly I could see Him an Speer trying to go for a Civil war against each other if they didn't go to war in 39 and Hitler died at some point later on, they where both Egotistical and Power Hungry and while aligned they had some differences in how they thought the 3rd Reich should go, Georing wasn't popular enough or influential enough to make his own push for power but he was powerful enough to tip the balance of power if either of those two made a push but it would have made the Germanic unification wars look positively pleasant in comparison.

 

[Skeletonized Cow]

Honestly I could see Him an Speer trying to go for a Civil war against each other if they didn't go to war in 39 and Hitler died at some point later on, they where both Egotistical and Power Hungry and while aligned they had some differences in how they thought the 3rd Reich should go, Georing wasn't popular enough or influential enough to make his own push for power but he was powerful enough to tip the balance of power if either of those two made a push but it would have made the Germanic unification wars look positively pleasant in comparison.

I suspect that would heavily rely on the state of the Reich when Hitler died. If the transition of power was relatively peaceful, and everyone's favorite chubster Goering took charge without much fuss, Goering might be able to tard-wrangle the Reich into not eating itself. If the Reich is imploding by the time Hitler dies, then it's absolutely civil war time.

I'm not sure if it would necessarily be SS v. Speer, or SS. v. the Reich though. Without the war, the SS won't be quite as strong as they were IOTL, and instead the Reich would probably split between the NSDAP et al. and a clique of the Wehrmacht who want to restore Germany to it's "natural" state of conservative military despotism.