Marathon 2025 - Bungie's new AAAA Extraction shooter

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fml said:
What I will never understand as long as I live is why the fuck would any company in 2026 ever go for BattlEye as an anti-cheat solution. Every BE game without exception is a cheater riddled mess, combine that with the fact that these companies don't seem to be doing the bare minimum of manual/stat banning people or are doing it really slowly.
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It's because Battle Eye takes on the responsibility of updating the way it detects cheaters, so devs can put it in the game and just forget it exists. Unlike something like Ricochet or other inhouse anti-cheats that the devs have to constantly update.

Basically Bungie is lazy
 
Professor Donger said:
It's because Battle Eye takes on the responsibility of updating the way it detects cheaters, so devs can put it in the game and just forget it exists. Unlike something like Ricochet or other inhouse anti-cheats that the devs have to constantly update.

Basically Bungie is lazy
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Except it literally doesn't work. Five seconds of searching can find unlimited instances of cheaters abusing games "protected" by those products.

Ah well. Let 'em keep doing it. It keeps eroding that narrative that "oh Linux isn't supported because our anti-cheat can't rootkit it" and lets us point and laugh that their "cheat-proof" shit on Windows is still rife with cheaters.
 
It raises the barrier to cheating and adds a nonzero risk of your account getting banned. Before meaningful anticheat technology existed, a game was often rendered unplayable within 12 months of release. Not "maybe this guy is wallhacking, idk if you can be THAT good," but "i literally cannot find a lobby where 5 seconds after spawning in somebody finds a way to delete my Office 2003 installation."

It was less bad in the pre-360 days because most games were hosted on private servers, and you'd find yourself IP banned pretty quick if you acted like a cunt. The nadir was 2005-2010 or so when everything was centrally managed, but there was basically no anticheat at all.
 
The Ugly One said:
It raises the barrier to cheating and adds a nonzero risk of your account getting banned. Before meaningful anticheat technology existed, a game was often rendered unplayable within 12 months of release. Not "maybe this guy is wallhacking, idk if you can be THAT good," but "i literally cannot find a lobby where 5 seconds after spawning in somebody finds a way to delete my Office 2003 installation."

It was less bad in the pre-360 days because most games were hosted on private servers, and you'd find yourself IP banned pretty quick if you acted like a cunt. The nadir was 2005-2010 or so when everything was centrally managed, but there was basically no anticheat at all.
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360 era was also not that bad because most people didn't have computers or the know how to make cheats for consoles
 
King Dead said:
Or more relevant to Bungie and Halo, when motherfucking Breaking Benjamin starts playing when you get to the end of Gravemind in Halo 2.

We truly didn't know how good we had it.
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Everything from 2004 to 2012 had bro coding all over it
moocow said:
Except it literally doesn't work. Five seconds of searching can find unlimited instances of cheaters abusing games "protected" by those products.

Ah well. Let 'em keep doing it. It keeps eroding that narrative that "oh Linux isn't supported because our anti-cheat can't rootkit it" and lets us point and laugh that their "cheat-proof" shit on Windows is still rife with cheaters.
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The rootkits in anticheats gave a bunch of pakis access to my friend's PC somehow and we heard a bunch of Pakis on call. They kicked everyone off his Steam friend's list too. You are actively punished for using anticheat rootkits via perfomance penalties and giving it Kernel level access.
 
Disc said:
You know, nobody really responded to this, so I think it's worth adressing.

When the next season and map come out, the playerbase will rally to some degree. The question is, though, how much will it rally?

There's two models I can think of as immediate examples. The first and I think more obvious one is destiny 2 itself:

View attachment 8825354

In this, a 'major content release' is generally a 2x to 3x rally of the playercount, while a 'minor content release' is more like 1.5x to 2x.

The other option is something more like Temtems:

View attachment 8825476

Where it's major content releases generally stirred up roughly the same group of diehard players, kicking the timeline of it's playercount back a few months.

I think the destiny cycle is a lot more likely, myself. Regardless of which it ultimately is, I don't think just going trvst the plvn is going to save marathon.
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Such updates mostly help player retention, not growing playerbase. Seasonal model also alienates new players because of FOMO, knowing there's a bunch of shit you've missed that's likely never coming back only raises barrier to entry.
I've seen enough GAAS to know that it's fucking over for Marathon.
 
BScCollateral said:
I'm kind of amazed that entertainment companies keep making products so expensive it is profoundly unlikely they can make a profit.
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Because the decisions are made by people who live outside of any reality that doesn't involve graphs showing profit margins. You could spend hours explaining to them that chasing Fortnite's bag is a fool's errand because the people who want to play a game like Fortnite already have Fortnite, but all these retards see is Epic's financial reports and they become convinced that can be them if they just do the same thing.

Same with movies: Warner Bros saw Avengers Assemble break box office records and decided they could do the same thing and shat out Batman vs Superman without laying any of the ground work the MCU spent years covering before swinging for the fences.
 
Professor Donger said:
I mean yeah it doesn't work, Bungie doesn't care if it does or not
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You'd think they'd be pissed they were getting ripped off, what with being sold a useless product that doesn't do what it's told, reduces the potential audience size (and thus reduces total available revenue at play), doesn't achieve the original goal, makes their own product worse, makes them look bad (and incompetent and lazy), and further discourages sales and ongoing revenue for their product.

Do the faggots just hate money now or something? Ignoring all other concerns, using a non-functional anti-cheat system fails to prevent cheating, which devalues the actual product, which reduces what money they can make with it. Surely that can reach their pea-brains?
 
Disc said:
When the next season and map come out, the playerbase will rally to some degree. The question is, though, how much will it rally?
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The best thing Bungie could do is to make a Whisper of the Worm type of content for Marathon. For people who didn't play Destiny 2, WotW is a secret mission which was dropped when Destiny 2 had rough period of time during I believe Warmind DLC (less than one year after D2 release). The random portal was spawning during public event on Io and you could jump there to start a mission which was quite cool - simple labyrinth you had to traverse for limited time (20 minutes), quite strong fighting and boss in the end (for the time at least). The design of level was very good, OST stuck into my head (you can check here) and general vibe was very good. The reward was a reprised weapon from Destiny 1 and at the time it was a meta weapon (and few times after with buffs). The gimmick of the weapon was a sniper rifle with unlimited ammo. Lore wise it is a Worm God (very powerful entity) carved into a weapon which quite cool.

If they drop an actually good mission I can see players surging since it is one of the most memorable content in the game. People were asking for such exotic missions for years and they sort of did them every season but mission generally were worse. There is something cool about mission being secret rather than a mission which scheduled to be released somewhere in middle of a season.
fml said:
What I will never understand as long as I live is why the fuck would any company in 2026 ever go for BattlEye as an anti-cheat solution. Every BE game without exception is a cheater riddled mess, combine that with the fact that these companies don't seem to be doing the bare minimum of manual/stat banning people or are doing it really slowly.
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I believe BE is just one layer of anticheat. Bungie has own anticheat measures, but as you can imagine like anything created by modern Bungie it is a shit. They also fired whole anticheat team few years ago, pretty sure it didn't help as well.

What makes me mad that they can't even catch cheaters using statistics like people having 100% accuracy rate or people killing whole team in the first second of a match. I remember watching some streamers checking stats of opponents during game loading and instantly realizing that they cheaters because of insane stats.
 
The Ugly One said:
It raises the barrier to cheating and adds a nonzero risk of your account getting banned. Before meaningful anticheat technology existed, a game was often rendered unplayable within 12 months of release. Not "maybe this guy is wallhacking, idk if you can be THAT good," but "i literally cannot find a lobby where 5 seconds after spawning in somebody finds a way to delete my Office 2003 installation."

It was less bad in the pre-360 days because most games were hosted on private servers, and you'd find yourself IP banned pretty quick if you acted like a cunt. The nadir was 2005-2010 or so when everything was centrally managed, but there was basically no anticheat at all.
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Anticheats I think function a lot like locking your door: if someone really wants to get through your door, they probably can, but some hooligans just looking to fuck around will probably just rattle the handle and walk on by.
 
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fml said:
What I will never understand as long as I live is why the fuck would any company in 2026 ever go for BattlEye as an anti-cheat solution. Every BE game without exception is a cheater riddled mess, combine that with the fact that these companies don't seem to be doing the bare minimum of manual/stat banning people or are doing it really slowly.
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Layer-0 perms raping anticheat does work, in that it takes a lot of effort and chaining multiple exploits to get cheating software working that get patched the same week, which is why cheats for modern multiplayer games from studios that give a fuck are sold as a subscription now, the pinoy programmer behind it needs to pay for his pagpag. You do have to have people working on countermeasures and updating the anticheat constantly though, but Bungie doesn't give a fuck, they made an announcement about the cheating problem and their main focus was fucking stream sniping.
 
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Snekposter said:
So, Gray Zone is currently on sale for $26 and change, worth it for someone looking into a PvE time waster after the Payday games crapped themselves out?
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For $26 I think it's worth getting and fucking around with as long as you wanna do extraction shooter PvE with the milsim aspect of Tarkov and less autism.

The helicopter system takes some getting used to and does occasionally mean an annoying wait, but besides that for the asking price it's pretty fun to fly to a landing zone on a little bird then make it to any POI and light up some Vietnamese. A few locations like the underground bunker and sawmill are fun set pieces for lighting dudes up and they fixed the weirdest damage to enemies bugs.

There's not a ton of great loot or anything, but you get to play SOF soldier man and such in a more bite size fashion than something like ARMA.
 
Stock Footage said:
The Forever winter is the closet I have played to PvE Co-op extraction shooters that you are describing that is decently fun. Unfortunately the game had an extremely rough launch and was overshadowed by its competition. But, the devs have fixed many of the performance issues despite the game still being in early access. however if you can get past the UE5 jank the game has one of the better gameplay loops of any of the PvE extraction shooters in my opinion.
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It's good to hear that The Forever Winter has been getting fixed up by the devs. Their game concept is quite compelling and I would like to see them succeed.
 
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