Pokémon (Not-So) Griefing Thread - Scarlet and Violet Released with 10 Million Copies in First 3 Days in Buggy States

[The Ultimate Ramotith]

In light of those 'fan-made Pokémon animations' videos and fueled by the mass griefing here over Z-A, I wondered what would happen if the Pokémon company decided to pull a 'Sonic Mania': having Pokémon fans be in charge of making the next region.
TLDR: that would be an even bigger, far more woke mess that will sell massively all the same.

The above is actually a bit of an exaggeration, since not everyone will be trying to 'pwn' the official Pokémon games. In fact, some of them would try to send their improvements out of a love of Pokémon and an actual happiness towards the way Pokémon is doing. However...

The most important factor will b ensuring that every Pokémon will be included in the game. Everything else, including story, gameplay, graphics and performance will be secondary to making sure that Dexit does not happen. If anything, there will be mo regional variants and attempts of bringing back cut Pokémon, say, Bet Arceus, Mega Flygon, and Kotora. I am not sure abou they bringing Fakemon... if they could ever do so in the first place. They might employ people who are known forgers of new Fakemon.

Of course, the above requires tha there would be only one version of the mainline game and at least implemen the Link Cable in dealing wi those trade volutions. We all can agree tha this would be a welcome change.

Initially, plans regardin gameplay would be split between those who wan to improve the current system and those who wan to upend the system completely. Eventually, the ones who insis that Pokémon gameplay got stagnant will be the ones wi the loudest voices and therefore will be the ones who win. The problem is that, since the only goal will be 'evolve the gameplay into something different', the resultin gameplay will be a clashing mishmash of ideas that vaguely resemble an open-world Pokémon game. I feel tha there would be a large difficulty jump in protest on how easy and linear the games are. The only guarantee would be Pokémon following the trainer in the overworld, a feature that will get a disproportionate amount of care.

Graphics will be split and ominated the same way: the Colosseum side that wants to simply give 3D models more life and personality wil lose to the Black and White side who wants to mak everything 2D. In this case, the game will ge the HD-2D Octopath Traveler treatment, which, I Optimistically say, wil lower the toll on whatever game system this game will have. I feel that would make the game look pretty, since a disproportionate amount of care will also be put on making high quality animations. (So far, avoiding Dexit beats following Pokémon beats high quality 2D animations MASSIVELY beats everything else.)

The story will be a big improvement, but only because the game will break away from the standard Pokémon story. The story will be darker, but not in a 3edgy5me way, sinc even hackers and hack players find those types of stories LOLco worthy. There will also be some of that overthinking fans tend to do. The rival will be a big jerk again. I actually believe tha the story will come out very good, though some Kiwis will find that story 'cringey fanfic slop'.

The inspiration of the new region would be from whatever, though the map layouts will be more complex. You will also be able to actually enter houses and shops unimpeded, even if there was not a 2D art style that simplified things.

I feel that music will be shortchanged unless they manage to ge Toby Fox into the project.

Most of the advertising will be online, since that is the place wher everyone will ge their news in the first place. A few people who were with Pokémon since Red and Blue will make surprisingly creative commercials that appear on television, but only out of nostalgia.

I feel tha the localisation would be surprisingly high quality only because dedicated Pokémon fans are all around the world. The main script will be in English because the hacking sphere is mainly focused there, but I expect pretty big Spanish localisation because of the large Spanish-language hacking scene.

The 'boring stuff', which includes manufacturing, legal stuff, distribution, and whatnot, will be ignored. This will be the most influential risk that might make the games collapse.

The real biggest problem, though, would be that queer people will eventually be in charge of the project. One thing we know about queer people are their large correlation with big technological skills; trannies make up a large section of the moddingsphere, meaning tha they will already have a large advantag even in a politically neutral environment. After all, if you manage graphical high fidelity while having high performance, only Kiwis and religious people will objec to your identity. Another thing we know is their massive narcissism: using 'Nazi ba' reasoning, they will kick off and massively cancel anyone who even remotely disagrees wi them. The result would go beyond 'body type A nd B' that can equip any clothing; the latest mainlin entry would be Pokémon: Special Sylveon Edition that will proudly show 'colourful' flags and pro-queer slogans and irectly fund queer businesses. Worse, if the story will not be a queerwashed

recycling of the same old Pokémon story, whatever better story tha the others already made will take on those traits all of the same:

• The player character will have a plot about suffering from queerphobia, if not from the player's cishet family, then from a persistent figure. Other people will practically lovebomb the player character with enabling, eventually culminating into the queerphobe changing thons ways after losing a Pokémon battle.
• Team Rocket will appear but be the good guys. The player character can join them. There is a lot of 'saf edgy' stuff instead of, say, actual murder, which they canonically did in Pokémon Red and Blue.
• Instead, the real bad guy group would literally be Nazis and TERFs. There would not be a 'Team Arrow' or some fancy name; the group wil literally just be called 'Nazi' or 'TERF'. Trainer classes that are members of those groups would be Policeman, Tiki Wielder, Priest, Businessman, Landholder, Troll, Rune Maniac, and anything else. Elon Musk (doing that fake Nazi Salute), JK Rowling, Joseph Nicolosi, Anita Bryant, and whatever Slawwel Ryams of the left will be th Executives of the bad guys, all while Donald Trump being the apparent leader. Once again, there would be absolutely no effort in converting these people to a Pokémon character; you wil literally be fighting Donald Trump in thi story.
• The Man Behind the Man would be a Jew... not even a Zionist, but a Jew. After all, according to trannies, Jews frequently commit genocide, regardless of ceasefires, against harmless Palestinians out of colonialism, hence they do not care about basic human rights. Oh... and o not forget he 'Greedy Jew' and 'Jew s are running this world' stereotype, hence the capitalism. (Yes; the Jew is literally in charge of the Nazis in this theoretical game.)

Despite all of the above, that woul do the opposite of tanking the Pokémon company. I mentioned this already in a different context, but Pokémon is invincible. If the objectively buggy, borderline unplayable Scarlet and Violet broke sales records, then a totally trannified Pokémon game will outsell the original Red and Blue. This would be Horrifyingly enabling to those who are working on the games. Already, the fans will poin to the higher sales numbers and consider that absolute proof that they will make a Pokémon game that is better than the official ones instead of those higher sales numbers already being an independent pattern. Queer people, however, will massively orgasm... very likely literally. Them being effectively in charge of the largest media franchise in the world, pandering their ideology to literal children, and having their work break sales numbers would bring heroin-level euphoria to their narcissistic minds. Left unattended, this will bring a cycle where queer people will be put in charge of a new game (which will bring even mor euphoria), make the game their way, and bring massive sales numbers. Then again, anyone who tries to get in the way of this cycle will be subjected to rape and murder.

 

[Wafting Breeze]

In light of those 'fan-made Pokémon animations' videos and fueled by the mass griefing here over Z-A, I wondered what would happen if the Pokémon company decided to pull a 'Sonic Mania': having Pokémon fans be in charge of making the next region.

Ignoring the rest of the schizophrenia: fans are fucking awful at making Pokemon games. All of the romhacks that aren't balance patches are uniquely awful, and most of those that aren't made by Drayano suck too. Sonic Mania worked because the solution to the problems Sonic was facing were already there in the classic games but Sonic Team was letting the classic style rot or farming it out to incompetent fuckups like Dimps. Pokemon has never sunk as low as Sonic 4. I pray we never have to see another major franchise have its equivalent of a Sonic 4.

 

[The Ultimate Ramotith]

Ignoring the rest of the schizophrenia: fans are fucking awful at making Pokemon games. All of the romhacks that aren't balance patches are uniquely awful, and most of those that aren't made by Drayano suck too. Sonic Mania worked because the solution to the problems Sonic was facing were already there in the classic games but Sonic Team was letting the classic style rot or farming it out to incompetent fuckups like Dimps. Pokemon has never sunk as low as Sonic 4. I pray we never have to see another major franchise have its equivalent of a Sonic 4.

You pray, but Pokémon having its equivalent of Sonic 4 is only a matter of time. Even if most of the profits come fro merchandising, stopping Pokémon games would be cutting off the lifeblood of the series. Recall that Scarlet and Violet upended and massively outsold Legends Arceus. The priority is in keeping the gravy train rolling. When you add profitable nostalgia-pandering, the Pokémon company will eventually end up recreating Sonic 4.

 

[Retarded Weeb]

farming it out to incompetent fuckups like Dimps

Hey, Dimps made the Advance trilogy, Rush, Rush Adventure, and Colors (DS), all of which were good games. One shit game doesn't make them incompetent fuckups on the whole, especially when it's partially Sega's fault for having them turn a mobile game they were experimentally designing for touchcreen controls into a console release because some exec really wanted to put out game with the title Sonic 4 slapped onto it thinking it improve the series' image after Sonic 06.

Also, since Sonic 4 was a spin-off that was originally meant for mobile, one could argue we've already had a Pokemon game equivalent to Sonic 4, it just wasn't given a title that gives it undue attention and expectation. Some of the spin-offs and mobileslop Pokemon has put out has been pretty dire.

 

[Strangolapreti]

In light of those 'fan-made Pokémon animations' videos and fueled by the mass griefing here over Z-A, I wondered what would happen if the Pokémon company decided to pull a 'Sonic Mania': having Pokémon fans be in charge of making the next region.

There's a difference between Sonic and Pokemon:

As a premise, fan games tend 90% of the time to follow the original formula without innovating, which is a blessing and a curse.
This is not exclusive to fan games, you can find multiple Hollow Knight inspired titles that copy the controls and movement bit by bit and its the reason souls-like became a genre the ubislop formula is a thing: it worked once, so it must work again, and the differences between your Silksong and deltarune when compared something like Bo, path of the teal lotus or Undertale fangames are like night and day, in these two cases, its all for the better, but in other times (salt & sacrifice, axiom verge 2), not so much.

The issue with sonic games is that they still haven't figured out how to properly re-invent and innovate the game with its sequels, with every new idea introduced being more often than not a fucking mess.
This is why Sonic mania was a success, as the franchise constantly failed in their pursuit of implementing new stuff, going back to the roots and play a regular sonic game felt like novelty for once.
I don't think it's a bad thing, I simply think Spark the electric jester is a better title, since it both delivers a good speed platform but also add new mechanic in the form of costumes.

Pokemon's issue is just stagnation, plain and simple. The battle system hasn't really changed in decades, only getting minor tweaks and shit gimmick that gets discarded and fished back for member berries, and almost every pokemon fan games tend to stick to this same, rotten system with minor tweaks when the reality is that everything needs a severe rework.
Pokemon AZ is trying to do that, but just like sonic games, it's ass at it.

Sonic mania never magically solved Sonic, it never introduced a brand new mechanic that allowed the franchise to evolve, it simply made a good old Sonic game.
It was successful, but ultimately had no impact on the series.

And for the same reasons, hiring a pokemon fans to make a pokemon game cannot fix the franchise either.
Its gonna be succesful, maybe even a good game, but ultimately will have no concrete impact on the series when compared to game freak making the same game themselves, aside of not releasing a shit game for once.

 

[Computer God Autism]

And for the same reasons, hiring a pokemon fans to make a pokemon game cannot fix the franchise either.

I disagree. Depending on how you count it, we've been without a traditional Pokemon game for either seven or thirteen years. The overworld formula has degenerated, not stagnated, and it could be easy to bring more out of the battle system without needing to fundamentally change it just by overhauling the numbers and having a more competent AI, because the old battle system did work and work well.

But you are right that it won't have any concrete impact on the series. It could produce the best game since Gen 5 and Gamefreak would still ignore it out of spite a la the Orre games.

 

[Strangolapreti]

I disagree. Depending on how you count it, we've been without a traditional Pokemon game for either seven or thirteen years. The overworld formula has degenerated, not stagnated, and it could be easy to bring more out of the battle system without needing to fundamentally change it just by overhauling the numbers and having a more competent AI, because the old battle system did work and work well.

Ok I had forgot that the world map has been lobotomized and streamlined over time, that too is an issue, but I fear that alone is not gonna be a contribution but rather a bigger reason for criticism.
I fear players got so used to current pokmeon maps, they are gonna scream and mald at the sight of a slightly more complex map, or maybe the devs ends up overcorrecting and create a labyrinth of a map. Feel free to call me wrong on this, but this is the kind of stuff that people are always ready to criticize and rarely compliment when done properly, just how many people have you seen praising the Tin tower or Shoal cave? I don't even think people enjoy to traverse them without a full stack of repels, and those are the "dungeons" I liked, you don't want me to remind you of the shithole that is the Whirl islands.

But you are right that it won't have any concrete impact on the series. It could produce the best game since Gen 5 and Gamefreak would still ignore it out of spite a la the Orre games.

Thinking about it, its quite funny how BOTW was so successful and impactful that goytendo startes to re-use it for other games in the worst way immaginable, like how Mario Kart World takes place on BOTW's hyrule, or the shitty Zelda game where you play as Zelda has the scrolling menù from that game and let you pause the game to use consumables at any point.
Maybe it wouldn't be a good game to make a succesful pokemon game that's innovative, lest you get even the smallest (and even questionable) piece of game design forcedly inserted into other titles.

 

[Wafting Breeze]

let you pause the game to use consumables at any point.

Kind of funny that ZA sidestepped this by limiting when you can weave in menu access and giving consumables a strict cooldown.

 

[Hiphopopotamus]

PKhex updated for ZA.

Legality check is as always lacking for legends games.

 

[Lone MacReady II]

or the shitty Zelda game where you play as Zelda has the scrolling menù from that game and let you pause the game to use consumables at any point.

Frogmire has an entire video on that. It's hilarious how bad the menus are in ubisoft Zelda, I can remember TP with its weapon wheel and it worked so good. Echoes of Wisdom has consumables and all the summons, and they're just stamped right onto BOTW's antiquated menu system and it looks so tedious. Visually as well the menus look sterile and oh so cancerously uncharming.

 

[Archeops]

I’ve officially completed all of the main missions in Z-A and gotten the Shiny Charm (that 1,000 Trainer Battles task is the devil but it's doable in a day or two if you get 30-40 battles in per night). So far I've encountered a Shiny Furfrou, Onix, Diggersby, and Alpha Bellsprout with Shiny Charm assistance but I'm not sure if I'm doing the fast-travel loop properly.

Now I'm looking at online matches and I'm seeing people using Gardevoir, Lucario, Excadrill, Gyarados, and other hard-hitting Pokémon but I'm also hearing that the Speed stat isn't as important as is in mainline titles and that bulk is preferred.

I have several Alphas of the above barring Gyarados so I could easily craft some but I guess I'll have to do some more research. The only thing that might get in the way is the fact that Alphas now come with 252 HP EVs which makes EV training a bit of a hassle.

Thankfully there is an NPC outside of Pokemon Centers who will give you every missed ball back. I'm surprised they even bothered thinking of that.

The best part is that they'll return ANY Poké Ball you use including Master Balls.

PKhex updated for ZA.
View attachment 8088395View attachment 8088397

Legality check is as always lacking for legends games.

If there's one thing I like about PKhex is that Kaphotics occasionally rips into VGC competitors for running blatantly-hacked Pokémon. The guy knows that, if the hacking problem gets out of hand too quickly, TPC and GF can easily give TPCi better hack detection tools like the ones used in Yokohama last year that'll make it much harder to compete using genned Pokémon.

 

[Hiphopopotamus]

If there's one thing I like about PKhex is that Kaphotics occasionally rips into VGC competitors for running blatantly-hacked Pokémon.

They're very retarded about it is the thing, all you have to do is hatch an egg of the pokemon you want, then you can edit it from hatch to whatever stats and egg moves you want, and no one would know.
Instead they just use the same base pokemon and have all the same memory codes and encryption constant. It's really easy to pass hack checks if you aren't retarded.

 

[Retarded Weeb]

I don't even think people enjoy to traverse them without a full stack of repels, and those are the "dungeons" I liked

This touches on something I think has always been an issue with the series. Dungeons as a concept just don't work well with how Pokemon is designed. The main challenge with dungeons in RPGs is that they're expeditions into the unknown that you have to prepare for, the obstacles within will wear down on your resources, and you have to make decisions if something goes wrong. Generally RPGs are harder the more random encounters can fuck you over with things like status effects while you have relatively little resources for curing things or quickly escaping, while RPGs are easier when enemies are just trash mobs that you can power through without much worry because you have a lot of resources to heal with or even easily teleport out of the dungeon.

You tell Red/Green was designed with more traditional RPG design choices in mind, so I'm guessing GF had some intention for dungeons like caves and forests in Pokemon to work the same way, but it just doesn't because
1. Random encounters aren't threatening. They're low level and easy to run from - in fact you'll basically always succeed unless you're using a slow Pokemon and you're early in the game where the level difference isn't as big. You only fight one at a time, so even if you don't run from them you can easily just OHKO it before it attacks and move on. Even if you're not using Repels, the random encounters can't threaten you in any way except waste your time.
2. Repels are cheap, plentiful, and available to buy early in the game, so for like 95% of the game you don't even need to run into random encounters if you don't want to. As such, you can easily just walk around dungeons with nothing to threaten or challenge you at all, not even the threat of getting lost since Escape Ropes are also cheap and easy to get.

Wild Pokemon encounters are so pathetic that Pokemon players don't even think of them as an obstacle. They're just a resource to catch or grind on whenever you want, and can be ignored whenever you don't. So what's the point of dungeons? From a purely gameplay perspective, there isn't much of one. It's just nice to feel like you're actually out exploring the wilderness instead of mindlessly holding forward to continue down a hallway in a game for babies.

Of course, I've been ignoring trainer battles. They're the closest thing to serving the role random encounters are supposed to serve, but they do feel different because of being a one-time thing each that you generally see coming. And there's kind of weirdness here flavor-wise, in that trainers by their nature make more sense hanging out in populated areas, which means that the far-off wilderness and secret areas that would normally be the most dangerous in the average RPG are instead the easiest because there's no trainers there and the wild Pokemon don't matter. Ironically, in Pokemon it's the cities where the most challenging content is while the untamed wilderness is just for show. Just look at RGBY where the Power Plant and Seafoam Islands are neat optional dungeons hidden out of the way, but there's no people around so there's not much to do in them besides walk though until you reach Zapdos/Articuno (and do a Strength puzzle to get to the latter). The places like Team Rocket hideouts are actually the most dungeon-like areas because they're complex areas you're not supposed to be in and filled with trainers. That's why I maintain that Silph Co. is the best dungeon in the series.

I think this is a big thing Legends Arceus did right that got it on many people's good sides. It is lacking in any real "dungeons" besides a few small caves, but the wilderness in general actually feels dangerous to be in because of design. They changed the numbers some in the game so that damage variance between levels isn't as big, making lower-level Pokemon relatively more threatening, plus they can gang up on you and get extra turns, making them a real risk or at least wear down on your resources even when you outlevel them. They also attack you the player directly and will get extra initiative if you're forced to start a battle already getting attacked, it encourages you to actually treat the Pokemon like a threat and be careful around them, and to isolate and sneak up on them if you want to start a fight with them. The only thing really getting the way of making things like feel like dangerous expeditions you need to prepare for is that like pretty much all open-world games, the fast-travel is overly generous. You can actually avoid ever blacking out from fall damage by just fast traveling while you're falling, for example.

 

[I mean I'm just saying]

Dungeons as a concept just don't work well with how Pokemon is designed.
[...]
Wild Pokemon encounters are so pathetic that Pokemon players don't even think of them as an obstacle.
[...]
Of course, I've been ignoring trainer battles. They're the closest thing to serving the role random encounters are supposed to serve, but they do feel different because of being a one-time thing each that you generally see coming.

I think similarly to these statements in particular and think Pokemon is really missing a trick by not making some sort of roguelike/lite game. Similar to Emerald Rogue or PokeRogue which both had their moment in the sun a while ago, but with actual money and no legality worries behind it.
You could wholesale rip off the Slay The Spire map system, shove the Pokemon battle system into it, and make a completely coherent game with very little extra adaptation needed:

• Standard encounter nodes translate to trainer battles and wild encounters
• Elite encounters are legendaries and/or stronger trainers with better rewards
• shops are pokemarts
• rest points are pokemon centers
• special events can be things like the safari zone, special move tutors, legendary/mythical events

Floors translate into 8 badges (or fewer for shorter runs) and final boss becomes E4.
Wild encounters become a resource to be managed similarly to nuzlocke runs that have that "only first encounter per route is catchable" rule, but actually integrated into the game for real.
Also it means GameFreak barely has to write a story or animate cutscenes if they don't want to, which may be best for everyone.

 

[Garbage of Cesspool]

They're very retarded about it is the thing, all you have to do is hatch an egg of the pokemon you want, then you can edit it from hatch to whatever stats and egg moves you want, and no one would know.
Instead they just use the same base pokemon and have all the same memory codes and encryption constant. It's really easy to pass hack checks if you aren't retarded.

Extra hilarious when you know that for YEARS the hack checks on PKHex and derived programs were more thorough (and might still be) than the official ones. A lot of retarded cheaters just use Discord bots and don't actually know the first thing about legality or mon file structure, hence their retardation.

 

[Hiphopopotamus]

Extra hilarious when you know that for YEARS the hack checks on PKHex and derived programs were more thorough (and might still be) than the official ones. A lot of retarded cheaters just use Discord bots and don't actually know the first thing about legality or mon file structure, hence their retardation.

Nintendo just doesn't give a fuck, they want the stats and moves legit and real, because if they went any further most of the players would be banned and there would be no tournament.

At 4 hours 31 minutes and 12 seconds you can see the player's Terapagos has an OT of "FreeMons.org" and this was just last June.

It's a free website you can ask to have any pokemon generated and traded to you, it'll just have the OT mark of shame. If they cared they would've banned him on the spot.

 

[starborn427614]

Finally got access to Mega Evolution in Legends. Game's starting to feel better now that it's taken the leash off.

 

[nicotinehouse]

Genning pokemon in pkhex gets complicated fast, there's many little details one can miss that make it telling a pokemon has been edited. To make a pokemon completely realistic I catch it myself without hacking and trade it to a save on a modded switch with edited in bottle caps, EV minerals, rare candies, and mints, then use those resources to make it how I want, and trade it back. It enables me to skip time consuming gameplay almost completely. I can also just edit effort values and levels but it's easier to do it through the game itself so I don't have to remove the sd card to edit. It amazes me that some VGC players don't even put in that modicum of effort to appear legit, but again I don't participate in play! pokemon as I don't want to be in the proximity of troons, so there might be an inside joke as to why some VGCers are blatant with the cheating. Also could be incompetence, lack of caring, or some combination of the 3.

What Nintendo checks for at VGC now is that a pokemon has a valid "home tracker." For example, a player has an Enamorus catchable exclusively in Legends Arceus and Pokemon Go, but is using it in scarlet and violet. The only way that could happen without save editing is if the Pokémon goes through pokemon home first, at which point it can be tracked because it touched an official online service. What I think they are actually checking for is "ah I see this person has an exclusive pokemon, did they at one point have a license to access that game when they went online to transfer it." For a pokemon to not have a home tracker and be legal, it must never touch pokemon home and be obtainable in a generation without coming from pokemon Home. They don't actually care if a player is editing pokemon, they know everyone is editing their pokemon, they just care that someone played one of their games without paying for it as Nintendo intended. I really think it's that basic.

I have no idea what the VGC people are going to do when the format moves to a Switch 2 only game with no backwards compatibility because the Switch 2 is not getting hacked anytime soon and even if it does that stuff will likely be thoroughly gatekept. I think it will be both hilarious and interesting to see what the VGCers do when they can't edit pokemon anymore. One good thing that might happen is Switch 2 gets modded exclusively because people "needed" to cheat in pokemon. I wouldn't be surprised if that happens to be the outcome.

 

[Grayback]

you can see the player's Terapagos has an OT of "FreeMons.org"

These blatantly-hacked Pokémon routinely show up in the GTS, too.

If TPC / Game Freak / Nintendo doesn't have a basic automatic system flagging names like this, then we can only conclude that they just don't care.

And they don't have any checks to prevent players from asking for impossible Pokémon + game combinations in the GTS, either.

Whoever's in charge just doesn't care at all.

 

[ToroidalBoat]

These blatantly-hacked Pokémon routinely show up in the GTS, too.

"Back in my day", people traded 'mons with cheat moves with a link cable.