Star Trek - Space: The Final Frontier

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Starscreams Cape said:
From what I heard Anson Mount as Captain Pike in S2 was the highlight of the series.
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Anson Mount would have been a great Pike but not in the Kurtzmanverse. In the second season, the character wasn't allowed to shine, to act or be respected as the Captain. Burnham and the other characters like the Admiral would always talk over him or do the opposite of what he said (and they would - of course - be right).
 
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Is it true they wanted to make the original Enterprise like a rocketship, but Roddenberry was all "no rocketships" because he wanted a new original look? What inspired the first design?
 
ditto said:
Just started on season two and I'm surprised at just how empty the Delta quadrant is. The phage aliens and the Kazon (apparently modeled on LA street gangs, not that it matters) and neither are at Federation level of technology. Replicator rations mentioned - and then quickly forgotten. Marquis presented as a threat - oh it's actually a Cardassian in disguise! The most interesting storylines so far are those could be done in any other Trek series.
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Thats pretty much why no one likes Voyager. Its concept was better executed in BSG, the status quo writing essentially causing the entire premise to be meaningless. And any episode they had which was good, usually could have been given to TNG or DS9 and been just as good. Honestly even DS9 wasnt that well liked at the time, people didn't like them abandoning the core optimism, and people had a strong feeling DS9 would go full STD.

Star Trek on a per episode or per season/film basis has been mostly shit. Its gotten by on it inspiring people with its themes and good episodes
 
2020Suicide said:
Thats pretty much why no one likes Voyager. Its concept was better executed in BSG, the status quo writing essentially causing the entire premise to be meaningless. And any episode they had which was good, usually could have been given to TNG or DS9 and been just as good. Honestly even DS9 wasnt that well liked at the time, people didn't like them abandoning the core optimism, and people had a strong feeling DS9 would go full STD.

Star Trek on a per episode or per season/film basis has been mostly shit. Its gotten by on it inspiring people with its themes and good episodes
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Voyager was also a canary in a coalmine of sorts for SJW incursion into our entertainment, though we didn't realize it at the time. I am NOT saying Voyager was SJW per se, but it was a show founded first and foremost on the premise of having a female captain. Fortunately some adequate and non-your-face SJW writing made the show mediocre, with some solid highpoints and silly lows. Also Kate Mulgrew did a pretty good job with what she was given.

I was around at the time and there was a much bigger hullabaloo about Janeway being a female captain than there was about Sisko being a black lead. Perhaps that was partially why DS9 was the better of the two.
 
Starscreams Cape said:
Voyager was also a canary in a coalmine of sorts for SJW incursion into our entertainment, though we didn't realize it at the time. I am NOT saying Voyager was SJW per se, but it was a show founded first and foremost on the premise of having a female captain. Fortunately some adequate and non-your-face SJW writing made the show mediocre, with some solid highpoints and silly lows. Also Kate Mulgrew did a pretty good job with what she was given.

I was around at the time and there was a much bigger hullabaloo about Janeway being a female captain than there was about Sisko being a black lead. Perhaps that was partially why DS9 was the better of the two.
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IIRC there were black captains and admirals even in TOS. Were there women captains or admirals pre-voyager? Im sure there were, on the other hand Gene put the most prominent women in the series in the roles of nurse, therapist, and secretary.
 
2020Suicide said:
IIRC there were black captains and admirals even in TOS. Were there women captains or admirals pre-voyager? Im sure there were, on the other hand Gene put the most prominent women in the series in the roles of nurse, therapist, and secretary.
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There was, the last iteration of the Enterprise had a female captain who came through a wormhole in an episode of TNG.
 
Starscreams Cape said:
Voyager was also a canary in a coalmine of sorts for SJW incursion into our entertainment, though we didn't realize it at the time. I am NOT saying Voyager was SJW per se, but it was a show founded first and foremost on the premise of having a female captain. Fortunately some adequate and non-your-face SJW writing made the show mediocre, with some solid highpoints and silly lows. Also Kate Mulgrew did a pretty good job with what she was given.

I was around at the time and there was a much bigger hullabaloo about Janeway being a female captain than there was about Sisko being a black lead. Perhaps that was partially why DS9 was the better of the two.
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Also like modern SJW it's hilariously neo-colonial. Surrounded by primitives that they are determined to keep primitive thanks to Janeway's interpretation of the Prime Directive. A local native they keep around for information and also as a cook. Janeway making summary judgements of life and death over the crew.
 
2020Suicide said:
IIRC there were black captains and admirals even in TOS. Were there women captains or admirals pre-voyager? Im sure there were, on the other hand Gene put the most prominent women in the series in the roles of nurse, therapist, and secretary.
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The black dude died first in Wrath of Khan, remember, and he was a captain. Same with Star Trek 4... uh...

Geordie's mom was a captain and uh...

There was that black guy in the command track in that episode with Nagilum... uhh..

Does Richard Daystrom count he was pretty important - wait

OK, Dr M'Benga didn't die a horrible stupid death, did he?
 
TaimuRadiu said:
Geordie's mom was a captain and uh...
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So basically just Geordie's mom and another woman while there were quite a few black captains even during the days of TOS when the Civil Rights Movement was mocked in real life forums the way this forum mocks SJWs.

like i said, by the time of DS9 black captains were normalized both in and out of canon for a long time. people would rather not talk about it despite us all knowing Gene's proclivities but women weren't really given the same treatment as minorities in Star Trek. just going by TOS, black men were given a surprising amount of roles in power, while women were given the role of fuck toy for the most part. TNG was better, but not by much
 
ditto said:
TNG gave us the first douchbag female admiral in Nechayev.
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thats true, its also true to say it was only 2 years later that we got Voyager and that they already came up with the idea's of new quadrant, female captain, mutineers for their next Star Trek Series as well
 
Starscreams Cape said:
Voyager was also a canary in a coalmine of sorts for SJW incursion into our entertainment, though we didn't realize it at the time. I am NOT saying Voyager was SJW per se, but it was a show founded first and foremost on the premise of having a female captain. Fortunately some adequate and non-your-face SJW writing made the show mediocre, with some solid highpoints and silly lows. Also Kate Mulgrew did a pretty good job with what she was given.
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VOY came out 95, 90's GIRL POWER! thing is hardly comparable to modern wokeshit. a female captain doesn't make something SJW, same way the spice girls weren't out to smash the patriarchy.
after 2 white guys and 1 black guy you could put money on the table and win the bet they'd go with a female captain just because she's not another dude.

2020Suicide said:
So basically just Geordie's mom and another woman while there were quite a few black captains even during the days of TOS when the Civil Rights Movement was mocked in real life forums the way this forum mocks SJWs.
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there was a black female captain in S1, together with an alien captain, hella diverse. turned out she was a mind-controlled traitor, but still...
it's not like TNG had to deal with other captains constantly, most of the time another starfleet official showed up it was a cunty antagonist.
 
ToroidalBoat said:
Is it true they wanted to make the original Enterprise like a rocketship, but Roddenberry was all "no rocketships" because he wanted a new original look? What inspired the first design?
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Yeah it’s part flying saucer, but Matt Jefferies made the engines back and separated because he felt that these huge engines that push the ship faster than light were scary as hell and needed to be as far away as possible from the main body.

The sleekness comes partially from Jefferies wanting the ship to not have weird shadows from bits sticking out, and partially from Roddenberry’s time in the Navy. Gene felt that there’s no way the crew would go on a spacewalk every time it needed repairs so instead the outside was smooth and all the repairs are done internally.
 
2020Suicide said:
IIRC there were black captains and admirals even in TOS. Were there women captains or admirals pre-voyager? Im sure there were, on the other hand Gene put the most prominent women in the series in the roles of nurse, therapist, and secretary.
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The actor who played Sisko's dad was also an Admiral in one of the TOS movies.
There's also Admiral Nechayev in TNG. If ENT counts as a pre-VOY era then the Captain of the NX-02 was a woman (Erika Hernandez).
I know people in the media or on Twitter always claim that Starfleet had a rule about no female captain, usually by quoting an episode of TOS but I think it's bullshit. The woman who said that (in the episode) was clearly mentally unstable and jealous of Kirk's career.

edit: sorry I didn't see UnKillFill's post while I was writing mine.
 
UnKillFill said:
Women weren't canonically even allowed to be Starfleet captains as of the last episode of TOS- where a woman literally bodyswapped with Kirk so she could get around that rule. That obviously changed by Voyager though.
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Yeah, from the episode where she was yandere for Kirk.

I think she was just insane.
 
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