The Elder Scrolls

[Mr. Racewar1488]

 

[TopTierHealer]

I never understood why people complain about morrowind hit chance failures. It makes sense to me. If you break down your skill on a 1 to 100 scale with 100 being a grandmaster then 30 should be the rank of novice and 40 of amateur. Trying to stab someone with a skill of 10 just means you will poke your own eye out.
I know there is a "whoosing" sound implying you missed but I think of it like you hit but did 0 damage.

Reading is fundamental to enjoy Morrowind, not trusting your gamer instincts. The first thing the innkeeper in Seyda Neen tells you is to never go into combat without stamina. Everyone and their grandmother give you excellent advice on what NOT to do. One of the members of the fighters guild tells you to pay for progress in armor skills because the alternative is getting stabbed. That's why the cost of training from 5 to 30 only increases by a few septims each, after 30 the costs sits in the 200-400 range depending on your disposition but paying 50-60 gold a pop for training? You get 500 gold for a reward + whatever you can loot. By the end of your quest you have 1000 drakes of disposable income. That's money that should go into getting your skills to 30, no contest. Bandit cave with plates, pillows and books? Well that's a nice 200 drakes right there! That's 4 levels of armor! that will help you improve your AC to raid better tombs!
It's vendor trash for a reason, you need every miserable coin you can get your Hlaalu hands on at the begining of the game because of the catch 22: I can't hit anyone because my sword skill is too low and I can't raise my sword skill because I can't hit anything.

I get no more videos recomending me Oblivion Remaster, thank God. I hate how the video is titled: "Paladin Class full guide!" and the first thing the author does is:

1. Steal a million potatoes
2. Make a million restore fatigue potions
3. Go to frostcrag spire

Every single time: bullshit your way around the economy, powerlevel to 40, go rescue Martin.

Fucking hell, I haven't seen a single video that didn't repeat the first 3 steps to a T and tried to pass it off as "esoteric Oblivion perfect guide". Yes, nigger, this was common knowlege 20 years ago, fuck off already. Oh look, another video explaining how to make 100% chameleon and steal from every single shop in the game, woah, how bold and original. Rate me MATI but I had to get it off my chest. I respect SorcererDave and his Oblivion LP where he plays a thief and commits to the character. His videos may be an hour each but you see him stealth through an aelyd ruin even when he could easily backstab everyone and cast alteration. I also like LyleShnub and his Morrowind Mondays - his voice acting really sells it to me.

 

[30+GameOvers]

I never understood why people complain about morrowind hit chance failures. It makes sense to me. If you break down your skill on a 1 to 100 scale with 100 being a grandmaster then 30 should be the rank of novice and 40 of amateur. Trying to stab someone with a skill of 10 just means you will poke your own eye out.
I know there is a "whoosing" sound implying you missed but I think of it like you hit but did 0 damage.

It's a holdover from the old days of CRPGs when your stats is all you had to determine your chance to hit. Zoomies who never played those games are flabbergasted by the system since Skyrim is all they know, veterans of the CRPG fandom begrudgingly understand why it was done but they don't have to like it either. I'm more of a balance guy, as long as it enhances the early game experience by forcing the player to specialize in a certain playstyle, that's fine by me so I don't care. By the endgame, all those Bethesda titles fall apart and you become jack-of-all trades Jesus anyways.

 

[HTTP Error 404]

I guess there's a new version of OpenMW out. Got a clickbait article sent to my phone about it. The LUA scripting mode is now better integrated which has everyone excited, I guess?

 

[LovisXVI]

I guess there's a new version of OpenMW out. Got a clickbait article sent to my phone about it. The LUA scripting mode is now better integrated which has everyone excited, I guess?

Damnit, I just installed it on a new machine the other day. Suppose I don't have to update until my mods do at least.

 

[Lone Wandering Courier]

I guess there's a new version of OpenMW out. Got a clickbait article sent to my phone about it. The LUA scripting mode is now better integrated which has everyone excited, I guess?

The new version of project tamriel didn't work with 0.48.x of openmw and you had to dowload or compile beta builds to play it.

 

[Caddo Cobgang]

View attachment 7590814

leaked TES VI loading screen lore !:
"Pykis Diddler of Hammerfell was arrested in Chorrol in 4E 1 for paying a 8-year old Nord Girl to come to his large house outside the city walls and then making her pour a magicka potion on his back and then forcing himself on her but upon paying off the guard for 600 Septims he was allowed out of the dungeon"

 

[GratsTheat783]

I've played a bit of Tamriel Reborn for Morrowind and it's been pretty good so far, but on their site they mentioned "Project Cyrodil", or something similarly named, as a sister project. Is that mod any good?

 

[LovisXVI]

I've played a bit of Tamriel Reborn for Morrowind and it's been pretty good so far, but on their site they mentioned "Project Cyrodil", or something similarly named, as a sister project. Is that mod any good?

It's Project Tamriel, and it's got Skyrim Home if the Nords as well. Project Cyrodiil has just the Kingdom of Anvil so far, but it's better than all of Oblivion's map (and has greater dungeon variety as well).

 

[Froggy Fresh Sextape]

veterans of the CRPG fandom begrudgingly understand why it was done but they don't have to like it either

It was more acceptable in Daggerfall when everything was sprite art, then they brought the same system into Morrowind and it just felt really off. It's not gen Z, people who played Morrowind at release were complaining about that shit too. More animation/sound feedback would've been better.

 

[StacticShock]

It was more acceptable in Daggerfall when everything was sprite art, then they brought the same system into Morrowind and it just felt really off. It's not gen Z, people who played Morrowind at release were complaining about that shit too. More animation/sound feedback would've been better.

not even that, you don't mix action with dice roll, both fallout3 and new vegas got shitcanned because you shot a super mutant in the face with a 50 BMG and nothing happened either, until the mod where headshots actually work like headshots came.
same shit for daggerfall, you don't mix hit chance with action, that never works.

 

[Gimmick Account]

No it definitely works fine in Daggerfall because it's clearer what's going on. There's less to distract you from the miss/deflect sounds as feedback and the enemy sprites have only a few animations, one of which is an obvious hit/stagger state.

It's just less obvious in Morrowind since you're fighting a lot of mutant nightmare fungus aliens instead of normal recognisable shit like bears. Combat is slower and enemies are further apart so you're getting much less feedback for things to click, too.
Plus Daggerfall has a starting dungeon designed to just fucking kill you in the first 10 minutes if you haven't got a handle on things or rolled some dogshit character.

It's not really a zoomer-specific issue (although I'm sure they would really struggle); Morrowind was my first TES game back in college and I'd played plenty of more traditional RPGs by that point. But invisible hit/miss rolls weren't common in 3D action games of the time, and it's a weird-ass game so you don't know what to expect, unlike Daggerfall which is very obviously a DnD-type world. So I remember finding it odd momentarily.

But still, you should work it out by like your second mudcrab if you aren't retarded and it stops being an issue like an hour in anyway. I don't think it's a great design to go with (despite which, Daggerfall ends up being my favourite), but the whole complaint is overblown.

 

[Froggy Fresh Sextape]

Plus Daggerfall has a starting dungeon designed to just fucking kill you in the first 10 minutes if you haven't got a handle on things or rolled some dogshit character.

or you get the ebony dagger from your character background and just eviscerate everything

Personally I never had a problem with the combat system in Daggerfall or Morrowind but I can understand why people think both are trash.

 

[dustnight]

No it definitely works fine in Daggerfall because it's clearer what's going on. There's less to distract you from the miss/deflect sounds as feedback and the enemy sprites have only a few animations, one of which is an obvious hit/stagger state.

It's just less obvious in Morrowind since you're fighting a lot of mutant nightmare fungus aliens instead of normal recognisable shit like bears. Combat is slower and enemies are further apart so you're getting much less feedback for things to click, too.
Plus Daggerfall has a starting dungeon designed to just fucking kill you in the first 10 minutes if you haven't got a handle on things or rolled some dogshit character.

It's not really a zoomer-specific issue (although I'm sure they would really struggle); Morrowind was my first TES game back in college and I'd played plenty of more traditional RPGs by that point. But invisible hit/miss rolls weren't common in 3D action games of the time, and it's a weird-ass game so you don't know what to expect, unlike Daggerfall which is very obviously a DnD-type world. So I remember finding it odd momentarily.

But still, you should work it out by like your second mudcrab if you aren't retarded and it stops being an issue like an hour in anyway. I don't think it's a great design to go with (despite which, Daggerfall ends up being my favourite), but the whole complaint is overblown.

Perhaps what they should have done is some sort of 'dummy' HP that is guaranteed for every hit but doesn't do very much damage and also regenerates. Only the real hits permanently remove health along with dealing the real damage values.

 

[Gimmick Account]

Perhaps what they should have done is some sort of 'dummy' HP that is guaranteed for every hit but doesn't do very much damage and also regenerates. Only the real hits permanently remove health along with dealing the real damage values.

View attachment 7603169

Why do you mean? For the purpose of feedback so you can tell your clicks are doing something at low skill levels?
That'd achieve that I guess but you're also adding another layer of odd shit for players understand on top of the main issue of understanding the main unintuitive system. Just adding text for hit/miss/damage numbers would do the same thing.

I think if we wanna talk about what would have been a better idea, it's simply what they and everyone else did later: get rid off whiffs and miss/dodge stats as a concept. A visible hit is always a hit, and rescale health/gear/damage range calculation values around that change. If you want to dodge then just actually dodge, since movement is already a product of the applicable mobility stats. Ideally foes could also think with their legs a bit in combat, but that's asking a bit much from Bethesda.

...Unless you're making a joke about some other game in which case you missed me and this text is the feedback on that.

 

[30+GameOvers]

not even that, you don't mix action with dice roll, both fallout3 and new vegas got shitcanned because you shot a super mutant in the face with a 50 BMG and nothing happened either, until the mod where headshots actually work like headshots came.
same shit for daggerfall, you don't mix hit chance with action, that never works.

New Vegas did solve this problem by re-introducing DT and actually balancing it's weapons. You clearly never played the game.

But still, you should work it out by like your second mudcrab if you aren't retarded and it stops being an issue like an hour in anyway

That's precisely the point, it doesn't really matter if it's intuitive or not since most seasoned CRPG players will get to gripe with it rather quickly. Like I said, it works for balancing reasons: Combat oriented characters will realize that they have to focus on one kind of combat skill and need to raise it fast, otherwise it's better to avoid tougher enemies altogether until you figure it out. The game throws a simple problem at you and expects the player to use it's set of tools to solve it themselves. This is nothing new, most RPGs do this, however the zoomer expects to be held by the hand and will likely rage quit before that happens. Eventually, you will get enough skill points in your chosen weapon proficiency or magic to reliably hit most enemies and the combat gets "tolerable", since it's nothing special even when it does work. This is why the road to being able to kill enemies efficiently is usually more fun than becoming overpowered and rolling right thru them in the latter half of the game. You don't really get that in Oblivion due to awful level scaling that means you never really make much progress unless you exploit the game, and Skyrim is always piss easy and I doubt a Morrowind style skill point system would fix that either. There really isn't a perfect system here, you either make an RPG-esque stat table or you make an action game where even a level 1 character can kill tougher enemies, in theory, if they find the right weapons since they don't need any in-game skill to use them. At least with the former, you get quantifiable way to tell how good your character is via numbers, in the latter it's all about how good the player is, and Skyrim's combat system isn't even that good. It's one thing if we're talking about a game where combat requires skill, like Devil May Cry or Metal Gear Revengeance or any other game of this kind or even Souls likes with their various combos and builds, where as TES and Fallout for that matter haven't evolved past the basic "swing like a retard, occasionally block or use a power attack" so every fight is the same. No skill required from the player, at least with numbers you need to work on raising them to be proficient.

 

[StacticShock]

New Vegas did solve this problem by re-introducing DT and actually balancing it's weapons. You clearly never played the game.

tell that to my TTW modlist which includes the headshot mod because playing otherwise is just a boring experience if you don't use explosives with 10 LUK because FO3/FNV wanted you to weigh when to use V.A.T.S in order to get a kill, back off stops being funny after the 10th knockdown if you are retarded enough to not use the headshot mod, same shit for morrowind in specific with misses becoming glancing blows mod, it makes the game into something playable rather than liquid shit it is.

and at the end of the day a regular player's boredom level is what matters, being forced to slow down when you come from a higher pace is something not everyone is willing to do and i don't blame anyone that doesn't want to waste their limited time with retarded shit, it's also why i always recommend the no scaling mod for any oblivion playthrough with the regular warning that clannfears have natural reflect.

if we're talking about a game where combat requires skill, like Devil May Cry or Metal Gear Revengeance or any other game of this kind or even Souls likes with their various combos and builds

nigga why you using oxymorons like souls and skill, telling sign you joshing.

 

[30+GameOvers]

tell that to my TTW modlist which includes the headshot mod because playing otherwise is just a boring experience if you don't use explosives with 10 LUK because FO3/FNV wanted you to weigh when to use V.A.T.S in order to get a kill, back off stops being funny after the 10th knockdown if you are retarded enough to not use the headshot mod, same shit for morrowind in specific with misses becoming glancing blows mod, it makes the game into something playable rather than liquid shit it is.

You mentioned the .50 BMG rifle specifically, which will get a headshot kill to anything in the base game aside from maybe some tougher creatures or robots that don't apply a headshot damage modifier. Maybe if you actually played the vanilla game, you would know that

nigga why you using oxymorons like souls and skill, telling sign you joshing.

Anything takes more skill than Skyrim, it has to be the easiest, most dead brain game in the world(which is telling why it's so popular).

 

[Lone Wandering Courier]

Imagine pretending that Skyrim isn't a (somewhat) challenging game. That is your brain on elistism, it leads you down a rabbit hole towards deranged and delusional takes.

 

[StacticShock]

You mentioned the .50 BMG rifle specifically, which will get a headshot kill to anything in the base game aside from maybe some tougher creatures or robots that don't apply a headshot damage modifier. Maybe if you actually played the vanilla game, you would know that

tell that to the super mutant that tanked the shot, yes, weapons at 100 with aim mode and full CND, not V.A.T.S in vanilla at low render range. (now that i have a better gpu i can increase it though)
so much so i told you what happened after, had to swap to a shotgun for the back off perk and boy it was boring, the explosives run was far better especially because of the pickpocket live explosives damage multiplier and raul to kill the bots that got emp'd since i didn't feel like wasting plasmas on them, veronica's pathing bugs too much and her awareness range is fuckhuge which is a problem for stealthing.

Imagine pretending that Skyrim isn't a (somewhat) challenging game. That is your brain on elistism, it leads you down a rabbit hole towards deranged and delusional takes.

skyrim becomes difficult past level 30 if you don't add any points to health because enemies will start to instakill you since you still have 100 health, course you can resto loop shit but unless you make a increase health potion it won't help with dragons even if you are decked on full 20%~14% protections as they will bite animation you within three seconds, but hey it's console focused game so it's hard to get soflocked because of that as you can vist any alchemist and buy a 40 extra health potion.