Russian Special Military Operation in the Ukraine - Mark IV: The Partitioning of Discussion

[Danann]

The people calling the shots in Ukraine are in Washington. The effective head of the government in Ukraine is Victoria Nuland of the US State Department. When Zelensky wanted to fire the Commander in Chief of the military, she was personally sent to Ukraine to sort out all the problems and determine who would be the next head of the military.
In 2014 in the immediate aftermath of the overthrow of the Ukrainian government, Nuland personally selected the ministers for the new government.

Nuland is neocon Robert Kagan's wife. She went from the Clinton Administration to serving as a henchwoman for Dick Cheney to seamlessly serving the Obama and Biden Administrations. Republican or democrat, she is there.
Her relatives run the Institute for the Study of War which determines the narratives associated with the conflict in Ukraine.

Ahh, so Zelenskyy is a figurehead, got it. In other words, have Victoria Nuland killed then. She'd helped weaponize Ukraine in the event they decided to tell Russia to go fuck themselves, of which we already did by the time the USSR collapsed. All she needed was a figurehead to help activate our plan and ZelenSSkyy was the perfect candidate.

Killing zelensksyyy is like building a time machine and killing baby Hitler.

You'd only wind up with someone competent instead.

A Ukraine capable of winning over Russia? ....nah.

 

[Vesperus]

A Ukraine capable of winning over Russia? ....nah.

No, but maybe someone smart enough to work out a peace treaty...

You hit the nail on the head with Nuland. This is absolutely her war, the psychotic cunt.

 

[Just Some Other Guy]

Hey, at least they havent used the general winter and captain mud excuse yet.

Maybe. But they did blame shrubbery.

 

[Betonhaus]

Politician promises X, he proposes law X, gets shut down. I knew it wouldn't pass but i proposed it, i did what i said. They can't be held accountable.

Generally the requirement should be that they HAVE to do X or they get punished, no matter what. It's more important to get them to stop making promises they know they can't keep.

A system could be that they provide a deadline and propose their own punishment, and that gets held to them so if they miss the deadline they have to get the punishment they propose. Politicians that promise slap-on-the wrist punishments would clearly not have faith in their ability to pull off their promise, same with ones that offer their neck but for a very vague promise or deadline. It should be possible to sue them if they are violating the spirit of their promise by reinterpreting the exact wording, and hold them to the spirirt of their promise.

---

...with many news sources parroting the allegations that Russians are dying in droves in a zerg rush, is it possible that's a conspiracy that Russia "leaked" to news sources so that America stays convinced that they can win a battle of attrition and don't need Nato to directly intervene?

 

[Alabama Gamer]

have Victoria Nuland killed then.

All other considerations aside, assassinating an "American" (Jewish) politician is a major line to cross that Russia isn't ready for.

 

[Betonhaus]

All other considerations aside, assassinating an "American" (Jewish) politician is a major line to cross that Russia isn't ready for.

Better to utterly humiliate them. After Russia wins they can have a disclosure of the things Nuland did that sabotaged Ukraine's defense efforts

 

[Napoleon III]

Denmark urges Europe not to hide behind production problems in supplying weapons to Ukraine

https://archive.ph/GXj25

The prime minister pointed out that European leaders often cite problems with arms production as an obstacle to increasing supplies.
"We, Denmark, have decided to transfer all our artillery to Ukraine. So, excuse me, but the issue is not just about production. Europe still has military equipment. It has to be transferred to Ukraine," she said.
Mette Frederiksen also stated that Europeans should not wait for the crisis to be resolved with the approval of financing of supplies from the United States for the Ukrainian Armed Forces. "It doesn't matter what the US comes up with, but we, Europeans, have to defend ourselves. This is a war on the European continent," she stressed.

ENDQUOTE

Things are really getting quite desperate. Things like this happen because the Danish Prime minister really actually only cares what the State Department thinks. If she is saying things like this it means there is an extreme amount of Frustration at the inability for Ukraine to get equipment.

From Telegram:

Situation towards Zaporozhye at 10:00 a.m.
Units of the Russian armed forces advanced a total of 2 km in sections in the evening and night hours.
Several large oporniks and prisoners were also taken.
The attack continues.
Archangel of Special Forces.

ENDQUOTE

Robotyne seems to be going somewhat quickly. Granted I'm only getting early sources but it seems to be going well. There is a theory that Ukraine especially doesn't have reserves here because they got sent to Chasov Yar and Avdeevka. In addition Russia could be attacking here to force Ukraine to pull reserve to around Robotyne in order to weaken the line for where they actually want to attack. If that is true things look like they are opening up strategically. That kind of attack somewhere else to force the enemy to send reserves there weakening the place you actually want to attack is something the Red Army used in WW2.

Ukraine publishes every piece of video of them killing Russians including shit like murdering POWs that makes them look like monsters. But for some unknown reason there is no footage of Russian mobics emerging from trenches in their thousands, shovels akimbo, being mowed down by hohol machine gun fire? Pure fucking projection.

This is doubly funny because Russia actually has a group of soldiers that are basically cannon fodder in the Form of the Storm Z detachment. These are the Penal units that Wagner set up and eventually got folded into the Russian Army after Prigo's temper tantrum.

But even so Ukraine can't manage to get any footage of human wave tactics.

All other considerations aside, assassinating an "American" (Jewish) politician is a major line to cross that Russia isn't ready for.

Sadly this is true. I'm not going to lie I liked it when the Libyans got revenge on the Libyan Ambassador.

Hey, at least they havent used the general winter and captain mud excuse yet.

Excuse me good sir but it is MAJOR mud. You got to get the alliteration in there.

 

[Cuckoman]

Why end the war?
The best outcome for everyone is that once the russians have taken control of the land they want, the front can stabilize and the war changes gear into a low-activity frozen conflict where both sides are entrenched and there is just very low-intensity shelling eachother occasionally.
Then that war can continue for a long time, that would solve ukraines resource issues as well. You don't need all that many soldiers or weapons to keep a very low-intensity conflict going.

This was, we can pray, maybe the conflict can go on for at least a decade. Maybe more.
Imagine what super high energy prices for another full decade will do to german industry, economy and society! I get hard just thinking about it.

 

[Betonhaus]

We, Denmark, have decided to transfer all our artillery to Ukraine. So, excuse me, but the issue is not just about production. Europe still has military equipment. It has to be transferred to Ukraine," she said.

Well I'm glad that Denmark feels like it won't get invaded anytime soon.

Why end the war?
The best outcome for everyone is that once the russians have taken control of the land they want, the front can stabilize and the war changes gear into a low-activity frozen conflict where both sides are entrenched and there is just very low-intensity shelling eachother occasionally.
Then that war can continue for a long time, that would solve ukraines resource issues as well. You don't need all that many soldiers or weapons to keep a very low-intensity conflict going.

This was, we can pray, maybe the conflict can go on for at least a decade. Maybe more.
Imagine what super high energy prices for another full decade will do to german industry, economy and society! I get hard just thinking about it.

Best if Russia closely monitors Ukraine's weaponry and just bombs any new weapons as soon as they arrive. I don't see a static border being stable without Russia opening announcing mission accomplished and NATO seething and tallying up how much they spent on this failure.

 

[Feline Supremacist]

Well I'm glad that Denmark feels like it won't get invaded anytime soon.

The only time anyone cared about Denmark was when the Nazi fetish for dumb blondes was in overdrive and that was nearly ninety years ago. No one cares about them enough to want to invade.

Syrsky just got a new medal!

 

[Betonhaus]

Were halfway to the two week deadline that I expect the war to end by, based on the accelerating changes over the past week I think I'll stand by my earlier statement.

The next two weeks are the most critical time. The shock of having a decent leader being replaced with one known to cause senseless deaths will be a heavy blow to the troops and make them lose faith in their orders. Plus the dramatic overhaul of the leadership means there will be interruptions in logistics and neglected gaps in the defenses, ones that will take too much time to resolve as the new leadership gets a clearer picture of what's happening and what works and doesn't work. Right now is the perfect time for Russia to ramp up the pressure, doing massive bombing runs and pushing through poorly defended territory. I would expect 75-90% of Ukrainian defenses, troops, and weaponry to be lost within the next two weeks. That dramatic loss could lead to the people losing faith in the government and beginning a serious insurrection. I'm pretty certain the war will be over in two weeks, though that may not be publicly announced for another week or two while the ramifications of what happened sinks in.

 

[Overly Serious]

I want to ask. Is there potentially any sort of connection between Zelensky sacking his previous general (for the stated reason that he planned to evacuate Adviika) and replacing several military heads in positions of tacticians and logistics management, and Adviika falling just a few days later?

If you want an unfounded possible connection, it's to fire the guy who has been calling for a fallback, a fallback that soldiers want, because you realise he is right and a collapse of the defences is inevitable, so that he can't take the credit for doing the right and popular thing. Don't make the common mistake of thinking all conspiracies succeed. They may have thought and probably did, that there was at least another month of defence in Avdiivka. Rule 1 of being a self-serving leader is if a subordinate you disagreed with turns out to be right, get rid of the subordinate.

At least that's how it's mostly gone in my personal career so maybe I'm just bitter. :/

Getting real tired of ungrateful piggers waiting to join the alliance until after they got invaded (they polled as like at most 20% interested in joining nato pre-2014), and then crying crocodile tears over how they supposedly are owed our help, only for our liberal dipshit politicians to wipe the cunts feet with their tears

But, we do owe the Ukranians. We have betrayed them. They were all set up for a peace deal with Russia which would have involved a commitment to neutrality (no big deal) and some sort of autonomy for the independent provinces and not shelling them. And then Boris Johnson swept in on a zipline and promised them whatever they needed to beat those peskie Ruskies. And the West is all-powerful so the Kiev regime went for it.

Only turned out we weren't. Am I absolving the Kiev regime? No, not at all. Am I saying we promised them we'd help and protect them with our fingers crossed behind our backs? Absolutely we did. Blood is on our hands for this conflict.

As is so often the case.

If you can't trust people at all, even in some basic way, the classical opinion is you can't legislate your way out of that.

Pretty much this. You just end up with ever higher stacks of laws that end up unenforceable in the best case scenario and enabling you to always find someone you dislike guilty of something in the worst. Hell, New York just created a law especially to prosecute Trump under - first ever person to be tried under it!

The only viable solution really is to have greater integration between the leaders and the people in general. You can't shun or blacklist someone a hundred miles away in DC that you will never meet. There's no way to enforce meaningful consequences on people who are part of a full on separate society than you - short of inter-societal aggression.

You need to look at ways of removing that chasm if you want anything to change.

 

[Camo Fox]

Were halfway to the two week deadline that I expect the war to end by, based on the accelerating changes over the past week I think I'll stand by my earlier statement.

I think it'll be another month or so, but with Ukraine pulling out more and more, Putin definetly knows it's joever soon and we'll see it ramping up till it is. Biden's 60m package won't do shit against the full force of Russia's human meat grinder. I doubt Putin would make the same mistake of last Summer, sitting on his victories and letting Ukraine regain some after getting new aid packages.

 

[Overly Serious]

The only time anyone cared about Denmark was when the Nazi fetish for dumb blondes was in overdrive and that was nearly ninety years ago. No one cares about them enough to want to invade.

Syrsky just got a new medal!
View attachment 5733239

I think I have to recognise the fact that I can no longer distinguish between satire and real events. This is the second time I see something that must be a joke but I honestly begin to doubt it.

 

[Susanna]

Man gets caught jerking it to Jap cartoons in the barracks once, and now he's going to be remembered by that callsign for all eternity after a drone rips his head off.

Oh, is that how it happened? I feel a lot less sympathetic now. I’d have assumed he just showed his jellyfin library one evening and got mocked because it was mostly anime. Not that this has ever happened to me of course.

 

[Mr Komo]

Odessa catacomb claustrophobic close quarter battle.
I call it.

You are absolutely right to call it. Odessa is built on a ridiculously expansive catacomb system 1600 miles long and 200 feet deep that saw extensive use during WW2. It's mostly a result of mining IIRC, but there are layers to it added at different times.

I'd be disappointed if there wasn't a tunnel rat battle. I'll settle for the flooding of it with water or gas though, because fuck fighting retard nazis on their terms.

 

[VargReallyDidNothingWrong]

I'd be disappointed if there wasn't a tunnel rat battle. I'll settle for the flooding of it with water or gas though, because fuck fighting retard nazis on their terms.

This is what flamethrowers are for, lad.

 

[Slur Generator]

Generally the requirement should be that they HAVE to do X or they get punished, no matter what. It's more important to get them to stop making promises they know they can't keep.

A system could be that they provide a deadline and propose their own punishment, and that gets held to them so if they miss the deadline they have to get the punishment they propose. Politicians that promise slap-on-the wrist punishments would clearly not have faith in their ability to pull off their promise, same with ones that offer their neck but for a very vague promise or deadline. It should be possible to sue them if they are violating the spirit of their promise by reinterpreting the exact wording, and hold them to the spirirt of their promise.

---

...with many news sources parroting the allegations that Russians are dying in droves in a zerg rush, is it possible that's a conspiracy that Russia "leaked" to news sources so that America stays convinced that they can win a battle of attrition and don't need Nato to directly intervene?

Sure but its never going to happen. They will defend their right to lie till their dying breath.

 

[Cuckoman]

You are absolutely right to call it. Odessa is built on a ridiculously expansive catacomb system 1600 miles long and 200 feet deep that saw extensive use during WW2. It's mostly a result of mining IIRC, but there are layers to it added at different times.

View attachment 5733317

I'd be disappointed if there wasn't a tunnel rat battle. I'll settle for the flooding of it with water or gas though, because fuck fighting retard nazis on their terms.

200 feet underground. Boring solution is to just dig a trench from the sea to one of the ingresspoints and let nature and gravity sort shit out.
Boring but easy to do.

Much more fun would be to pump a few million gallons of gasoline and other volatiles down there and let it vaporize.

 

[Saleh]

I'd be disappointed if there wasn't a tunnel rat battle. I'll settle for the flooding of it with water or gas though, because fuck fighting retard nazis on their terms.

There are ways to stop gas and water from extending through tunnels and you could read those being used in the Vietnam war. The North Vietnamese built their tunnels in a way to withstand gas or water flooding and would usually add ventilation shafts in case of gas attack. In addition, the tunnels were too long and deep for the flooding to be effective and the water would just get stuck in one section of the tunnel.