Hazbin Hotel / Helluva Boss Thread - Now a Griefing Thread

[AnOminous]

Well i will keep my eyes peeled for that- i hope not even if probably not for the right reasons.

We at least still have HB

Wouldn't surprise me in the least. Corporations are dumb. And this is probably a very difficult property to market. Do you water it down for popularity and ruin its only reason for existence? Or let a potentially egomaniacal creator go hog wild and blow the entire budget on craziness then fail? It's super unlikely to succeed but I would like to see it do so.

 

[Kuromiisweets.]

TL;DR - Viv made ZP a convoluted and character filled mess instead of what should've been a focused main character-driven story.

Zoophobia the webcomic was honestly one of the biggest wastes of potential I've ever seen in any piece of fiction. It was such a shame too because the intro, here to here, in terms of setting up a world and getting you invested in it, is honestly pretty brilliant - and yes I still stand by that. It sets up the main concept excellently, introduces a bunch of characters to you that you'd want to know more about, and has a pretty good balance of comedy (Cameron reacting to the world around her), mystery (the woman with the apple) and drama ("So I'm stuck here?"/the bit towards the end with Zechariah comforting Cameron).

So imagine, you're an impressionable teen and you're blown away by said introduction. You're hooked, and can't wait to see more of the adventures of this zoophobic counselor in the crazy world of animals. What's the next story arc gonna be?!

View attachment 1758690
A high school couple.....with the male forgetting their....anniversary? First of all, this is not how teenagers work. Secondly, weren't we just following Cameron a second ago? It is here where the main problem of ZP starts to rear its ugly head: a complete and utter lack of focus.

One minute, OK, we're following Cameron again, good. Next minute we're with the kangaroo again. Huh? Next minute we're with the demon kid (whose name is Damien, real original there Viv), and he has a robot...companion? Who can transform or some shit?
View attachment 1758702
And finally, we're back to Cameron again. It’s frustrating that ZP hits on a genuinely interesting story in Cameron, but doesn’t seem committed to it, instead plopping us in with a bunch of characters with no proper introduction and no reason to care about them (again, doubly frustrating considering Chapter 1 got it so right). Somebody could take the key components of Zoophobia and make a genuinely good story without having to discard many of them. It needed better pacing. It needed to better understand the story it was telling and be more aware of where it needed to go. There is a decent comic buried here, but it occupies about 25% of its run. I’d never, ever recommend it to another human being, but if you were forced to read it you’d likely find bits to enjoy.

Somewhere, in another universe, Cameron is the main character in a great story about overcoming your fears, meeting new people, and finding your place in the world. Maybe it was the project that put Vivienne on the map, maybe it wasn't. If you do end up reading Zoophobia at some point — maybe because you're interested in Viv's past work — pay attention to the bits involving Cameron. See her interactions with the people around her. Her dialogue. There’s a character there that Vivienne Medrano brought to life in spite of the script, in spite of the comic, in spite of anything going on around her. Pay attention to Cameron. Because she's exactly where the real ZP's buried.

A kangaroo complains that a purple and orange whatever-the-fuck forgot their high school anniversary while a pink demon robot nanny dukes it out with a bunch of police officers because her demon brat got in trouble. That's the Zoophobia we got.

A young, neurotic woman slowly but surely overcomes her fears while meeting all sorts of exotic, memorable characters and uncovering the mystery of the world she unwittingly finds herself in. That's the Zoophobia that we should've got instead.

Sorry for the sperg-out, I've been holding this in for 4 years......@Private Pyle, you have permission to blast me with ALL the puzzle pieces.

No, no you got a point. I saw a comic dub of the first intro and is quite alarming how nice the Cameron parts are even if everything else made it sour to me.
I do admit I have known what is like to bite a lot that you can chew and honestly I had to scrap and put on standby a story/ world that i was invested in because i wasn't able to see how I would keep a nice even tone and pace through the story- it was too much lol.
Maybe Viviane can write somewhat but HH might not be the type of story she could execute

Wouldn't surprise me in the least. Corporations are dumb. And this is probably a very difficult property to market. Do you water it down for popularity and ruin its only reason for existence? Or let a potentially egomaniacal creator go hog wild and blow the entire budget on craziness then fail? It's super unlikely to succeed but I would like to see it do so.

You got yourself a point there lol. It reminds me of the story i mentioning but at least I was wise enough to keep it for myself and my artist friend ( since I also struggled to see whom the story could appeal to lol. If i ever redo it I might stick to something more simple and even then-)

 

[AnOminous]

Oh I liked the coloring. It's pretty much my favorite part of it, that she picked a color palette and stuck to it. Mostly reds, yellows and blacks, aimed at regular hell and its violent citizens, with pink and white for the more sexual types and it's sleazier underworld.

While I disagree with you about the music part, I love the songs, I mostly agree about the coloring. I like the actual general choice of colors. My objection though is that to some extent, in some scenes, they tend to use shades of colors that are too close together to the point that the often busy animation makes it tricky to figure out what is going on. It actually looks pretty good on my higher end monitors but on a TV, it might just look like a mess of pink. Sort of like how 4 color comics worked, they might have to chill out with the stuff that looks good on computer monitors.

 

[Kuromiisweets.]

While I disagree with you about the music part, I love the songs, I mostly agree about the coloring. I like the actual general choice of colors. My objection though is that to some extent, in some scenes, they tend to use shades of colors that are too close together to the point that the often busy animation makes it tricky to figure out what is going on. It actually looks pretty good on my higher end monitors but on a TV, it might just look like a mess of pink. Sort of like how 4 color comics worked, they might have to chill out with the stuff that looks good on computer monitors.

Inside of every demon is a rainbow is kinda of almost nice?
It's the only song i can remenber even though the pilot had 3 or smthing

 

[Private Pyle]

Well i will keep my eyes peeled for that- i hope not even if probably not for the right reasons.

We at least still have HB

Even HB wasn’t that good in hindsight.

TL;DR - Viv made ZP a convoluted and character filled mess instead of what should've been a focused main character-driven story.

Zoophobia the webcomic was honestly one of the biggest wastes of potential I've ever seen in any piece of fiction. It was such a shame too because the intro, here to here, in terms of setting up a world and getting you invested in it, is honestly pretty brilliant - and yes I still stand by that. It sets up the main concept excellently, introduces a bunch of characters to you that you'd want to know more about, and has a pretty good balance of comedy (Cameron reacting to the world around her), mystery (the woman with the apple) and drama ("So I'm stuck here?"/the bit towards the end with Zechariah comforting Cameron).

So imagine, you're an impressionable teen and you're blown away by said introduction. You're hooked, and can't wait to see more of the adventures of this zoophobic counselor in the crazy world of animals. What's the next story arc gonna be?!

View attachment 1758690
A high school couple.....with the male forgetting their....anniversary? First of all, this is not how teenagers work. Secondly, weren't we just following Cameron a second ago? It is here where the main problem of ZP starts to rear its ugly head: a complete and utter lack of focus.

One minute, OK, we're following Cameron again, good. Next minute we're with the kangaroo again. Huh? Next minute we're with the demon kid (whose name is Damien, real original there Viv), and he has a robot...companion? Who can transform or some shit?
View attachment 1758702
And finally, we're back to Cameron again. It’s frustrating that ZP hits on a genuinely interesting story in Cameron, but doesn’t seem committed to it, instead plopping us in with a bunch of characters with no proper introduction and no reason to care about them (again, doubly frustrating considering Chapter 1 got it so right). Somebody could take the key components of Zoophobia and make a genuinely good story without having to discard many of them. It needed better pacing. It needed to better understand the story it was telling and be more aware of where it needed to go. There is a decent comic buried here, but it occupies about 25% of its run. I’d never, ever recommend it to another human being, but if you were forced to read it you’d likely find bits to enjoy.

Somewhere, in another universe, Cameron is the main character in a great story about overcoming your fears, meeting new people, and finding your place in the world. Maybe it was the project that put Vivienne on the map, maybe it wasn't. If you do end up reading Zoophobia at some point — maybe because you're interested in Viv's past work — pay attention to the bits involving Cameron. See her interactions with the people around her. Her dialogue. There’s a character there that Vivienne Medrano brought to life in spite of the script, in spite of the comic, in spite of anything going on around her. Pay attention to Cameron. Because she's exactly where the real ZP's buried.

A kangaroo complains that a purple and orange whatever-the-fuck forgot their high school anniversary while a pink demon robot nanny dukes it out with a bunch of police officers because her demon brat got in trouble. That's the Zoophobia we got.

A young, neurotic woman slowly but surely overcomes her fears while meeting all sorts of exotic, memorable characters and uncovering the mystery of the world she unwittingly finds herself in. That's the Zoophobia that we should've got instead.

Sorry for the sperg-out, I've been holding this in for 4 years......@Private Pyle, you have permission to blast me with ALL the puzzle pieces.

Yeah this really doesn’t give me high hopes for her works. Yeesh...

She's the epitome of white college-educated prima donna. She just so happens to be talented in animation.

Even the talented part is questionable.
She really is your standard privileged white bitch which just makes her undeserved success more infuriating.

Wouldn't surprise me in the least. Corporations are dumb. And this is probably a very difficult property to market. Do you water it down for popularity and ruin its only reason for existence? Or let a potentially egomaniacal creator go hog wild and blow the entire budget on craziness then fail? It's super unlikely to succeed but I would like to see it do so.

Yeah not seeing any hope for success in this series.

 

[One Man Bland]

>Viv isn’t releasing a fully animated Hazbin episode once every two days therefore the project has been dropped and Viv should be declared an unsalvageable hack who made nothing of value

Geez, I‘m pretty "meh" on Viv and her projects but come on, even under normal circumstances where an animated series is being managed by a big studio with seasoned pros there’s still at least a year or two of production that goes on before they have anything substantial to showcase. People seem to forget that in an age where everything can instantly streamed: making shit takes not just money, but a whole lot of time. That’s why TV stations pre-internet used to space out new episode releases in increments so the people working on the next season would have a decent head start and make the wait seem lesser to the uninformed viewer.

All things considered the release schedule was what I expected, they’ve been releasing smaller projects to maintain interest while still keeping consistent updates, and while I personally haven’t loved everything she‘s made every artist is more than capable of making their fair share of duds (including your favorites) and there‘s been noticeable improvement.

I think we can give her a minute.

 

[Kuromiisweets.]

Even HB wasn’t that good in hindsight.

Yeah this really doesn’t give me high hopes for her works. Yeesh...

Even the talented part is questionable.
She really is your standard privileged white bitch which just makes her undeserved success more infuriating.

Yeah not seeing any hope for success in this series.

Oh ik it wasn't stellar and a riot ; we simply have more content upcoming or not about helluva then Hazbin for the time being

Well at least viv polishes a turd nicely enough

 

[Private Pyle]

Oh ik it wasn't stellar and a riot ; we simply have more content upcoming or not about helluva then Hazbin for the time being

Well at least viv polishes a turd nicely enough

That’s basically her hat at this point.

 

[Yamma Damma]

yeesh this flip from lore shit to critical shit sure is something. Oh well.

That opening song could've been better visually. It showed a human proportioned girl and didn't even catch the fact that it was supposed to be about Charlie.

This silhouette didn't give you the hint it was about Charlie?

I get missing it on the first watch but not the second or third.

Well that rule might not apply to actual musicals-
The opening song from beauty and the beast for example establishes a shit ton about world and characters.

Hazbin just done a piss poor job because Vizie's music tastes aren't really it not to sound super snobbish lol

Beauty and the Beast is a full story from start to finish though. Hazbin is a PILOT. The groundwork is being laid out to build upon with time and money later. That's unfortunately not a fair comparison. (besides HH being worthy of the title "timeless classic" is something I highly doubt.)

Very true! But that opening was actually animated in color and not in shadows. Viv should've animated the beginning song sequence so it wasn't too ambiguous.

Oh you're not sounding snobbish. Her "I'm a musical/theatre kid" flex doesn't excuse boring/forgettable music sequences.

The monochrome had to help the ambiguity because again: This is a pilot for a longer story. They had to hint at what's come before and what's to come later to keep the viewers intrigued enough to want more in both aspects (and it worked, look how much we sperg about the little things).

Vivzie really is just a dumb person all around. The fact that she got a show up and running is a miracle in and of itself.

Alas it's a pity someone like her got so far- it do me making me bitter yet hopeful at the same time lol

It really is a case of undeserved success; she did practically nothing to earn this much success yet here she is. It’s unbelievable.
I’m sure whatever you can think of, it’s miles better than Hazbin or Helluva.

Hey, losers like these were made to give hope to the people of the world.
Case in point, Viv seemed to have gathered up clout from pandering to the sparkles of crowd for years. Nothing from any actual hard work or dedication.


“No u.”
Someone seems a little testy.


I think I heard A24 already dropped the show. Supposedly it wasn’t what they were looking for and they wanted something better. Which kind of proves they wanted to experiment and had no real hope for the show.
HH kind of prove the age old theory; no matter what you can come up with, fans will outdo you in every way.

Damn Private Pyle, who pissed in your cereal? I know you never had high hopes of Vivzie pulling this off but you at least had mild respect. Not anymore I guess?

I'm not going to defend Vivzie on a personal level because she hangs out at the SJW zoo and smells like the monkeys that are caged there. However on a professional level (surface level since I've never worked for her), you can't knock her for getting it done, getting it out there and raking in the money from lovers, haters, freaks, creeps and other fools. It takes a special brand of autism to make it that far on anything.

Don't be like the critical retards we've been mocking: Sit around being MOTI that some bitch made shit and is getting fame that should be yours or someone else's. That's a rule on the farms anyway: Don't say how much better you are because you probably aren't. Stick to nitpicking the product, not her. Until she says something else stupid than fuck what I said and have at it.

 

[Vyse Inglebard]

yeesh this flip from lore shit to critical shit sure is something. Oh well.

I apologize for the sperg-out once again, @Yamma Damma, it's just that I wanted to share my personal experience with some of Viv's work. It does look like she's gotten somewhat better with HH and HB, though. I just hope she can continue improving.

 

[AnOminous]

That’s basically her hat at this point.

And your hat appears to be being super buttmad at whatever. I can't figure it out but you seem mad.

 

[The Fair Lady]

I'm not going to defend Vivzie on a personal level because she hangs out at the SJW zoo and smells like the monkeys that are caged there. However on a professional level (surface level since I've never worked for her), you can't knock her for getting it done, getting it out there and raking in the money from lovers, haters, freaks, creeps and other fools. It takes a special brand of autism to make it that far on anything.

Don't be like the critical retards we've been mocking: Sit around being MOTI that some bitch made shit and is getting fame that should be yours or someone else's. That's a rule on the farms anyway: Don't say how much better you are because you probably aren't. Stick to nitpicking the product, not her. Until she says something else stupid than fuck what I said and have at it.

All of this. Viv is by no means an amazing person, but a lot of the recent criticism in this thread is pretty autistic and similar to that of the "anti Hazbin" tards.

 

[AnOminous]

All of this. Viv is by no means an amazing person, but a lot of the recent criticism in this thread is pretty autistic and similar to that of the "anti" tards.

Also the actual content is pretty good. So fuck the personal bullshit.

 

[Spergenschütz]

yeesh this flip from lore shit to critical shit sure is something. Oh well.



This silhouette didn't give you the hint it was about Charlie?
View attachment 1758818
I get missing it on the first watch but not the second or third.



Beauty and the Beast is a full story from start to finish though. Hazbin is a PILOT. The groundwork is being laid out to build upon with time and money later. That's unfortunately not a fair comparison. (besides HH being worthy of the title "timeless classic" is something I highly doubt.)



The monochrome had to help the ambiguity because again: This is a pilot for a longer story. They had to hint at what's come before and what's to come later to keep the viewers intrigued enough to want more in both aspects (and it worked, look how much we sperg about the little things).









Damn Private Pyle, who pissed in your cereal? I know you never had high hopes of Vivzie pulling this off but you at least had mild respect. Not anymore I guess?

I'm not going to defend Vivzie on a personal level because she hangs out at the SJW zoo and smells like the monkeys that are caged there. However on a professional level (surface level since I've never worked for her), you can't knock her for getting it done, getting it out there and raking in the money from lovers, haters, freaks, creeps and other fools. It takes a special brand of autism to make it that far on anything.

Don't be like the critical retards we've been mocking: Sit around being MOTI that some bitch made shit and is getting fame that should be yours or someone else's. That's a rule on the farms anyway: Don't say how much better you are because you probably aren't. Stick to nitpicking the product, not her. Until she says something else stupid than fuck what I said and have at it.

All of this. Viv is by no means an amazing person, but a lot of the recent criticism in this thread is pretty autistic and similar to that of the "anti Hazbin" tards.

This recent calvacade of autism has the same energy as Hazbin Criticals screeching about how her current projects would fail just because Zoophobia (something she did in the past), was a shit comic (fyi, I thought Zoophobia was trash). And both have been saying that Viv is white, even though she is half-Latina; HH Criticals also obsess over unreleased stuff and get incredibly autistic about it despite not knowing the overall contents.

VivziePop Derangement Syndrome truly has no bounds.

 

[Kuromiisweets.]

Let just hope if she gets any new writers that there good ones and that this is even executable. Otherwise it will remain as a wonky thing with a lot of promise and let's leave it at that.

 

[Private Pyle]

Let just hope if she gets any new writers that there good ones and that this is even executable. Otherwise it will remain as a wonky thing with a lot of promise and let's leave it at that.

Yeah, this is going to take a lot of work to be even half way executable.

 

[Kuromiisweets.]

Yeah, this is going to take a lot of work to be even half way executable.

At last whatever will come we will probably laugh at it one way or another lol

 

[Private Pyle]

At last whatever will come we will probably laugh at it one way or another lol

I look forward to the comedy of errors that is the production of the show.

 

[LavenderMenace]

Question.

Do y’all think that Hazbin Hotel would’ve worked better as actual pilot length (11-ish minutes) or as it is? (which is 30 mins.)

Do you think it could’ve worked better cut down? I think it would’ve been better to snip it down to 15 mins.

 

[Private Pyle]

Question.

Do y’all think that Hazbin Hotel would’ve worked better as actual pilot length (11-ish minutes) or as it is? (which is 30 mins.)

Do you think it could’ve worked better cut down? I think it would’ve been better to snip it down to 15 mins.

I don’t think it would make much of a difference tbqh