The Final Fantasy Thread

[Your Weird Fetish]

Tifa has a reason because during the Nibelheim incident, Sephiroth killed her father, almost killed her and burned down their entire village. That would have warranted a stronger reaction, I agree. Barret most likely knows that Sephiroth is a semi-legendary ShinRa war hero, so that's enough reason for him to want to kill him. And Red XIII has already been turned into a sock puppet for the writers by Aerith at this point, so who knows what he's thinking. But yeah, they should have talked about it more.

Remember in the original, much better Shinra building sequence where Barret initially assumes Sephiroth must be a cool dude because he killed the president?

 

[Duncan Hills Coffee]

If there's one thing that's always disappointed me about IX it's that half of the party basically become background characters after about disc 2 or so. Freya especially goes from being pretty talkative and having a decent role in the story to barely existing.

Freya's subplot is noticeably disappointing because she was meant to have a larger arc but it was cut due to time. You see remnants of the plot in the ending, but it falls a little flat since Freya really had no growth after Burmecia's destruction.

Personally, I always felt IX was more deserving of a remake than VII largely because of how much story was cut. IX's in this interesting space where it's a fantastic game but when you learn of the cut content you realize it could have been so much more. I still love the game and consider it to be my second favorite behind VII, but there are some glaring issues due to time constraints.

 

[Your Weird Fetish]

how'd he get his sword back

It's never brought up.

I'll get my people right on it.

This is a plothole I think. And always was.

It's not a sword. It's just a bit of gross sharp Jenova biomass that chooses to look like a sword. Sephiroth's real sword is in some underwater cave somewhere near Nibelheim presumably.

 

[verissimus]

If there's one thing that's always disappointed me about IX it's that half of the party basically become background characters after about disc 2 or so. Freya especially goes from being pretty talkative and having a decent role in the story to barely existing.

You could probably say that for a number of final fantasies honestly.

In FF8, the only playable character(s) that actually mattered was Squall and arguably Laguna. The other characters are just there especially after disk 2.
In FF7, honestly, all the playable characters besides Cloud and Aeris fall flat as far as the main story goes (which considering those two were initially conceived as being the hero and heroine of the game this is not too surprising). I'd probably rate Tifa as coming in 3rd.
In FF10, Kimari, Lulu, and Wakka really don't matter. Not exactly sure whether to lump Rikku though she certainly adds little overall beyond wanting to prevent Yuna from fulfilling her journey. Even Auron's significance to the overall plot is very limited.

 

[Your Weird Fetish]

Tifa and Barret do their jobs in the story well.

 

[Honka Honka Burning Love]

Triple Triad was the best FF minigame ever. I'm honestly baffled Square Enix just dropped it after one game and never brought it back or mentioned it again.

I agree except the way they made rules spread and shit like the Random Rule.

That was...ASS.

 

[Berrakh]

Triple Triad was the best FF minigame ever. I'm honestly baffled Square Enix just dropped it after one game and never brought it back or mentioned it again.

please be gone from this place.

It's not a sword. It's just a bit of gross sharp Jenova biomass that chooses to look like a sword. Sephiroth's real sword is in some underwater cave somewhere near Nibelheim presumably.

homeboy never got his sword back lmao

Remember in the original, much better Shinra building sequence where Barret initially assumes Sephiroth must be a cool dude because he killed the president?

The part that I still think was written before they decided Jenova was The Thing rather than an Ancient, since it had Sephiroth babbling about the Promised Land. It still fits with his true motivation to be fair, it was just the same time the player is led to believe Sephiroth is an Ancient when he's not.

You could probably say that for a number of final fantasies honestly.

In FF8, the only playable character(s) that actually mattered was Squall and arguably Laguna. The other characters are just there especially after disk 2.
In FF7, honestly, all the playable characters besides Cloud and Aeris fall flat as far as the main story goes (which considering those two were initially conceived as being the hero and heroine of the game this is not too surprising). I'd probably rate Tifa as coming in 3rd.
In FF10, Kimari, Lulu, and Wakka really don't matter. Not exactly sure whether to lump Rikku though she certainly adds little overall beyond wanting to prevent Yuna from fulfilling her journey. Even Auron's significance to the overall plot is very limited.

It's not a crime to be a supporting character. Or to not be totally necessary to the ultimate conclusion but adding to the story along the way. It just gets annoying when characters are treated as main protagonists because people happened to like them.

Tifa and Barret do their jobs in the story well.

Only Cait Sith did a bad job, as well as Yuffie and Vincent but they barely count. And I subscribe to the theory that Caith Sith was a later addition to fill the gap when they "cut" Yuffie and Vincent from the game before realizing they had time to re-add them as optional characters.

I guess Tifa and Barrett are weirdly underdeveloped for your first 2 party members though. I could see that argument.

 

[Tor Lugosi]

I guess I never gave much of a shit about FF8 and 10's casts. Most of the party members in them feel like they're there just because a Final Fantasy is expected to have a large party. For 7, yeah, I think Tifa's the only party member that remains relevant throughout the game beyond Cloud himself; the rest have their own little arc and then once that's finished then their involvement is pretty much done and they're just sorta... there, going along for the ride.

I guess it always stuck out the most for me in IX because the party members are used really well for the first two discs, feeling like they actually serve a purpose, constantly speak up during cut scenes, and have stuff to do during the plot... and then that mostly ceases to be the case for the rest of the game.

 

[iRON-mAn]

I guess it always stuck out the most for me in IX because the party members are used really well for the first two discs, feeling like they actually serve a purpose, constantly speak up during cut scenes, and have stuff to do during the plot... and then that mostly ceases to be the case for the rest of the game.

That's mostly because of the narrative shift. The first half of the game is focused on Brahne and stopping Alexandria's acts of aggression. That loops in Freya, to protect her hometown, and most of the other characters are brought in by necessity. They need Quina to get to the Outer Continent, they need Eiko to get to the Sanctuary, they enlist Amarant for extra muscle. But once Brahne dies the story escalates to chasing Kuja and stopping the assimilation of Terra and Gaia, and that part is only really personal for Zidane, Dagger and Vivi, so they get most of the focus. That said, I did enjoy the brief interactions between various groups of characters in the later portions, such as splitting up to face the guardians or in Pandemonium, that showed how much they had all bonded, not just the core group.

 

[Berrakh]

I guess I never gave much of a shit about FF8 and 10's casts. Most of the party members in them feel like they're there just because a Final Fantasy is expected to have a large party. For 7, yeah, I think Tifa's the only party member that remains relevant throughout the game beyond Cloud himself; the rest have their own little arc and then once that's finished then their involvement is pretty much done and they're just sorta... there, going along for the ride.

The characters who are consistently relevant are Cloud, Aeris, and Tifa more or less in that order. Tifa is in fact pretty irrelevant until Disc 2, she kind of is just "the other girl who Cloud knew as a kid" until then, and while she's present as the love interest would be that isn't exactly relevance. Like every other secondary character she is around and has her "moment" but beyond that is rarely necessary. But her subplot is really well foreshadowed so it feels like she's more relevant to the story even as a new player. It's really good.
Cid is an interesting case though because as airship operator he feels more relevant than the others once you get it. Even has some focus in the ending cutscene.

Aeris is briefly not relevant during the first half of disc 2 and even that's because she was originally planned to die in the middle of disc 2 at the Gaia Cliffs (hence why everybody acts like they didn't just lose someone). Once you collect some big materia and get the sub the plot returns to her posthumous plan. And even Cloud is not relevant during some shenanigans with Huge Materia, but that's very brief. It's when Cid takes over as party leader.

 

[Duncan Hills Coffee]

Cid is an interesting case though because as airship operator he feels more relevant than the others once you get it. Even has some focus in the ending cutscene.

Cid's character arc is also one of the more spectacle-driven in the game, since he manages to fulfill his dream about going to space. The scene where your party is floating above the planet is one of the most quietly powerful scenes in the game while also being visually impressive. It also has a profound effect on him since he makes that speech about the planet being a lonely little kid. Barret doesn't even get something like that, and he saved Corel from getting fucked by a train.

Aeris is briefly not relevant during the first half of disc 2 and even that's because she was originally planned to die in the middle of disc 2 at the Gaia Cliffs. Once you collect some big materia and get the sub the plot returns to her posthumous plan.

I think that works in the game's favor since it allows her death to affect the player with her just being gone. By the time the party has that scene where they're remembering Aerith, the player is able to connect with them as they talk about her and reconcile the fact that she's gone and nothing can bring her back.

 

[Berrakh]

Cid's character arc is also one of the more spectacle-driven in the game, since he manages to fulfill his dream about going to space. The scene where your party is floating above the planet is one of the most quietly powerful scenes in the game while also being visually impressive. It also has a profound effect on him since he makes that speech about the planet being a lonely little kid. Barret doesn't even get something like that, and he saved Corel from getting fucked by a train.

His arc is really underrated. Touches on a lot of overlooked themes about dependence and consumption as well as tying back to the overall message and plot. He says a lot of things about Science, and how he likes Science because it let him fly and expanded human possibility (flight and space being shorthand for this), but also bemoans that the dominant (ie profitable) use of science is just human comfort and placidity. Rufus even says some stuff to mirror this but I can't recall it perfectly.

I think that works in the game's favor since it allows her death to affect the player with her just being gone. By the time the party has that scene where they're remembering Aerith, the player is able to connect with them as they talk about her and reconcile the fact that she's gone and nothing can bring her back.

It does, I agree. I guess it's weird that Barrett will talk about how cold the weather is after that but you can interpret it as everyone just trying to say nothing if you must. I think that is the direction they went in some novelization. With Cloud becoming bitter and reclusive to an extreme degree and everyone just going through the motions.

 

[Marissa Moira]

Fuck the fucking Pride and Joy match against Bahamut and Fuck Leviathan for staying up in there air where I can't fucking hit him, fuck!

 

[Berrakh]

Cid's character arc is also one of the more spectacle-driven in the game, since he manages to fulfill his dream about going to space. The scene where your party is floating above the planet is one of the most quietly powerful scenes in the game while also being visually impressive. It also has a profound effect on him since he makes that speech about the planet being a lonely little kid. Barret doesn't even get something like that, and he saved Corel from getting fucked by a train.

That's the weird thing about Barrett, he has two resolutions. One with Dyne, which is the more powerful by far, and another with Corel which feels perfunctory. Like it's treated more as a Huge Materia checklist than his redemption from lack of emphasis.

 

[Burned Man]

homeboy never got his sword back lmao

I always took it to not really be his sword either but I guess it would be in character for him to leave it at the scene of the crime since he did the same thing to Tifa's dad. It makes it funnier to think of him just forgetting his sword and having to kill the zolom with the tree because of it.

That's the weird thing about Barrett, he has two resolutions. One with Dyne, which is the more powerful by far, and another with Corel which feels perfunctory. Like it's treated more as a Huge Materia checklist than his redemption from lack of emphasis.

I guess its a bonus redemption. I chalk it up to Barrett not caring to make amends with those people since he knows it wasn't his fault and he has much bigger problems to care about. Not to mention its not like he is about to take Marlene and move into a shanty town either way. That he even has a chance to win them back is a happy accident. Doesn't help it is possible to fail and allow North Corel to get trashed and forever lose Barrett's chance at acceptance.

 

[Berrakh]

I guess its a bonus redemption. I chalk it up to Barrett not caring to make amends with those people since he knows it wasn't his fault and he has much bigger problems to care about. Not to mention its not like he is about to take Marlene and move into a shanty town either way. That he even has a chance to win them back is a happy accident. Doesn't help it is possible to fail and allow North Corel to get trashed and forever lose Barrett's chance at acceptance.

I understand the idea, it just felt like eating potato chips after a sit down meal at a good diner.

 

[The Littlest Shitlord]

Wasn't there a replica of Sephiroth's sword you can win at the Gold Saucer? Maybe he's been using cheap replicas, LOL. Has there been a string of murders of weeb katana-collectors?

 

[Burned Man]

I understand the idea, it just felt like eating potato chips after a sit down meal at a good diner.

Fair enough.

Now I have this silly idea where unrelated competence at mini games or game events gets you other strange unnecessary plot resolutions instead of items or summons. Like doing the rocket sequence fast enough gets you a scene of Cid proposing to Shera instead of a summon. Beating the battle square as Tifa makes Zangan show up to congratulate her. Doing well during the parade and sparing the submarine crew has Cloud reminisce with them about his army days.

Of course I say this now as a joke but Remake will probably do this to help stretch out running time.

 

[AlexJonesGotMePregnant]

I always took it to not really be his sword either but I guess it would be in character for him to leave it at the scene of the crime since he did the same thing to Tifa's dad. It makes it funnier to think of him just forgetting his sword and having to kill the zolom with the tree because of it.


I guess its a bonus redemption. I chalk it up to Barrett not caring to make amends with those people since he knows it wasn't his fault and he has much bigger problems to care about. Not to mention its not like he is about to take Marlene and move into a shanty town either way. That he even has a chance to win them back is a happy accident. Doesn't help it is possible to fail and allow North Corel to get trashed and forever lose Barrett's chance at acceptance.

Barrett blames himself for Corel's destruction, much as Dyne did. A true redemption arc related to his relationship with Corel would have cheapened the deep pain that led to him becoming a terrorist in the first place. He didn't want to linger because even after saving it once, all he'd ever find there were the ashes of his home that he failed.

 

[Radical Cadre]

But how did Tifa use Sephiroth's sword??

Can't explain that.